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It was here that he blocked me, not allowing me an opportunity to answer. So I lost a half hour of work on a reply that went down a black hole when I went to post it. While he was all about declaring anyone who didn't agree with him as being in error, he finally realized he could not defend his doctrine.
I replied roughly as.

Quote""And my post with the copied list, answered directly to your allusion that somehow Jews are excluded from the new covenant and the ONE sacrifice for sins forever, and must instead be saved by a resumption of the old covenant. But they don't. Indeed I believe that declaring such is borderline blasphemy."

And once again you choose to either ignore what I said about this or just don't understand plain English. I never said it was right or acceptable to God that they are going to do this. In fact I have gone to great lengths multiple times to say that it is wrong for them to do this.

Which would make any future temple irrelevant. If it couldn't be consecrated it couldn't be desolated. Yet you have this whole grand scheme of "The" "Antichrist" defiling something that couldn't be defiled.

QuoteThis has nothing to do, as you continue to try and have me say, with the Gospel not being available for them. It most certainly is, but they have, are, and will continue, to choose to reject it. That is NOT to say that some haven't, nor will not, accept their Messiah because we see not only from the book of Acts, but all throughout history that indeed some do. However, the majority have refused and will continue to refuse Christ.

Yet you continue to fail to show us where scripture indicates there is a need for a rebuilt temple in the future. And what about all of the Jews for the 2,000 years before this future temple is built? Burning in hell?
I believe faithful Jews that walk in the Spirit of God, having been blinded by God Himself as per Romans 11, have been saved by the Son of God throughout the Christian era even though they don't know it.
http://israelinbibleprophecy.com/spirit_of_slumber.htm

This verse would seem a little summary of it.

1Co 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

QuoteThis will only change when the AntiChrist commits the abomination of desecration. This will be their, collective, wake up call.

All Darby. How can a temple that you indicate could not be consecrated (since you suggest it wouldn't have anything to do with God), be desecrated by a "The" "Antichrist"? In spite of repeated requests you still haven't shared the scriptures that you believe call for a future rebuilt temple.

QuoteYou have also, wrongly, accused me of being afraid to click on the link you keep trying to get me to go to to "see the truth". Well, I did click on it the very first time you posted it. What I saw was a hot mess.

Indeed it is a hot mess! From Jesuit Francisco Ribera's 16th century counter-reformation invention (though the Reformers never bought into it), to Manuel de Lacunza's millennial reign, assembled, tweaked and embellished with Margaret McDonald's dream by John Nelson Darby in the mid-19th century.
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/end_time_myth.htm

Yet this pop-doctrine still permeates half of the modern church, even as we watch Europe fall to Islam.
http://www.christianeschatology.com/falling_away_apostasy.htm

QuoteI have found thru my studies that websites like this, that are just a hot mess to look at, also tend to be wrong in what they are saying.

Now there's an intellectual approach! You don't like the way the site looks.
The reason it looks bad to you likely because you could see that it was espousing things that were contrary to what you choose to believe, yet made more sense. The term for that feeling is "cognitive dissonance". Which is also why you removed my ability to reply. If you were decent you would have blocked me after I replied, but you couldn't afford to see more truth.

QuoteThis one is no exception. I personally think they tend to be this way because it reflects where their information ultimately comes from.

Which would be New Testament prophecy through the lens of history, as viewed through the church tradition of historicism, as those great men of God of the Reformation approached prophecy. As opposed to the pop-19th century stand-alone doctrine of John Nelson Darby.

QuoteI cannot help but reflect on this passage when I see these types of sites:

1 Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

These sites are definitely confusing, not only visually but also in what they say, just as this one is.

Simply wishing something were so, doesn't make it so. This is only a reflection of your inability to consider prophecy through the church tradition of historicism, while approaching it with open eyes and a Berean spirit.

QuoteBottom line, the doctrines espoused on this site are not in line with the plain reading of Scripture.

Which well explains where your errors come from. A person could never understand the figurative language used in dreams and visions in prophecy with a "plain reading". If we could, where would we expect a literal 7 headed 10 horned scarlet beast to appear on earth? We can only understand these prophetic passages through the science of hermeneutics.

QuoteThey are not only visually confusing, but are also Scripturally confusing and Spiritually confusing.

Based on your approach it's not surprising you are confused.

QuoteThey are nothing more than another attempt by the enemy to lead people into error, and they have succeeded in your case. You try to accuse me of subscribing to whatever it was that Darby said. As I have never read anything from him, as I have told you, then that is a demonstrably false accusation.

Just like you, I didn't know John Nelson Darby was responsible for futurist doctrine, when I was a futurist either. So it wasn't a false accusation, but rather your perception that is was, because you are unfamiliar with the source of your eschatology. You can start here

John Nelson Darby "He is considered to be the father of modern Dispensationalism and Futurism."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Nelson_Darby

QuoteYou also have tried, repeatedly and unsuccessfully, to denigrate me by implying that I have not been lead by the Holy Spirit in my understanding of Scripture.

I did nothing of the kind. You are projecting, my friend. It was you that denigrated me, with suggestion that since you believe you are lead to your conclusions by the Holy Spirit, then by extension, that would indicate that if anyone draws a conclusion different than yours they could not be lead by the Holy Spirit.

QuoteYou reiterate this whenever I invite you to do the same. However, this is exactly how we are commanded to do it.

Jeremiah 29:12 Then shall ye call upon me, and ye shall go and pray unto me, and I will hearken unto you.

Jeremiah 29:13 And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart.

Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:

Matthew 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

We are also called to test whatever someone tells us thru Scripture, which is exactly what I do with EVERYTHING I hear. What you are saying does not agree with the plain reading of Scripture.

Acts 17:10 And the brethren immediately sent away Paul and Silas by night unto Berea: who coming thither went into the synagogue of the Jews.

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Acts 17:12 Therefore many of them believed; also of honourable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few.

So, once again and for the last time, you are leading people into error.

Yet you don't seem to realize that you make this judgment on the basis that you have been indoctrinated into a pop-19th century eschatology (with perhaps a little fudging of your own around the edges - which would make your view unique in all the world, which should offer good reason for alarm on your part). Something else you won't understand until you investigate it, is that following in Darby's doctrine you are not in a position to judge, as it is a glass house.

QuoteReply to this or not, it really doesn't matter.

So he invites me to respond, but then blocks me so that I waste a half hour of my time composing a response that goes down a black hole. Not surprising from someone who can't even explain where scripture demands his future rebuilt temple.

QuoteThis will be the last time I will reply to you because you are being willfully blind. I pray that one day the scales will fall from your eyes and you will come to the truth.

John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

My friend I well understand the "truth" of John Darby's futurist doctrine. That's why I consider prophecy through the continuous historic approach through which all Jews and Christians understand Old Testament prophecy was fulfilled, as well as the church approach to New Testament prophecy for its first 1800 years, including those great men of God of the Reformation.

I have studied all four approaches, and scripture through the lens of each one, as well as having had them poked and prodded in Christian forums over a decade. How many of the four approaches have you studied? Here's a little summary of each from a decade of offering and asking in Christian forums.
http://www.christianeschatology.com/

"And my post with the copied list, answered directly to your allusion that somehow Jews are excluded from the new covenant and the ONE sacrifice for sins forever, and must instead be saved by a resumption of the old covenant. But they don't. Indeed I believe that declaring such is borderline blasphemy."

And once again you choose to either ignore what I said about this or just don't understand plain English. I never said it was right or acceptable to God that they are going to do this. In fact I have gone to great lengths multiple times to say that it is wrong for them to do this. This has nothing to do, as you continue to try and have me say, with the Gospel not being available for them. It most certainly is, but they have, are, and will continue, to choose to reject it. That is NOT to say that some haven't, nor will not, accept their Messiah because we see not only from the book of Acts, but all throughout history that indeed some do. However, the majority have refused and will continue to refuse Christ. This will only change when the AntiChrist commits the abomination of desecration. This will be their, collective, wake up call.

You have also, wrongly, accused me of being afraid to click on the link you keep trying to get me to go to to "see the truth". Well, I did click on it the very first time you posted it. What I saw was a hot mess. I have found thru my studies that websites like this, that are just a hot mess to look at, also tend to be wrong in what they are saying. This one is no exception. I personally think they tend to be this way because it reflects where their information ultimately comes from. I cannot help but reflect on this passage when I see these types of sites:

1 Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

These sites are definitely confusing, not only visually but also in what they say, just as this one is. Bottom line, the doctrines espoused on this site are not in line with the plain reading of Scripture. They are not only visually confusing, but are also Scripturally confusing and Spiritually confusing. They are nothing more than another attempt by the enemy to lead people into error, and they have succeeded in your case. You try to accuse me of subscribing to whatever it was that Darby said. As I have never read anything from him, as I have told you, then that is a demonstrably false accusation. You also have tried, repeatedly and unsuccessfully, to denigrate me by implying that I have not been lead by the Holy Spirit in my understanding of Scripture. You reiterate this whenever I invite you to do the same. However, this is exactly how we are commanded to do it.

Jeremiah 29:12 Then shall ye call upon me, and ye shall go and pray unto me, and I will hearken unto you.

Jeremiah 29:13 And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart.

Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:

Matthew 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

We are also called to test whatever someone tells us thru Scripture, which is exactly what I do with EVERYTHING I hear. What you are saying does not agree with the plain reading of Scripture.

Acts 17:10 And the brethren immediately sent away Paul and Silas by night unto Berea: who coming thither went into the synagogue of the Jews.

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Acts 17:12 Therefore many of them believed; also of honourable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few.

So, once again and for the last time, you are leading people into error. Reply to this or not, it really doesn't matter. This will be the last time I will reply to you because you are being willfully blind. I pray that one day the scales will fall from your eyes and you will come to the truth.

John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

"You keep ignoring what I said."

Not in the least.

"I am NOT saying that the Temple is where Christians are going to need to go and worship."

How on earth did you get from my post that I thought the temple would be where Christians worship??

"It is the JEWS that are going to do it."

And my post with the copied list, answered directly to your allusion that somehow Jews are excluded from the new covenant and the ONE sacrifice for sins forever, and must instead be saved by a resumption of the old covenant. But they don't. Indeed I believe that declaring such is borderline blasphemy.

What about faithful Jews over the last 2,000 years, before their new temple and resumption of sacrifices? Burning in hell?

I believe that those Jews that may remain sovereignly blinded, but faithfully walk in the Spirit of God, continue to have the same disposition they have had throughout the Christian era. They are saved by the Son of God, even though they don't know it. In summary.....

1Corinthians 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and [that] no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

SPIRIT OF SLUMBER

" I HAVE READ THE BIBLE AND RECEIVED GUIDANCE FROM THE HOLY SPIRIT, and that's it. Nothing more to it....."

There, there, so then everyone who has read the Bible but arrived at a conclusion different than yours (Darby's) is in "gross error", because they obviously can't be guided by the Holy Spirit, since you are? Do you understand how juvenile and comical a declaration like that is?

I've seen it dozens of times before in "Christian" forums by those misguided enough to declare it, because they are unable to defend the doctrine they have chosen to follow. Nor do I need to be schooled by a futurist - remember, I was one. Reading the scriptures prayerfully, that demonstrate the errors in Darby's pop-19th century futurist doctrine, is how I was able to overcome it.

Even as you were unable to explain where SCRIPTURE describes the need for a physical temple to be built, that you think the Jews will need for some reason, during this new covenant era.

While you don't even seem to recognize how unChristian (indeed Nicolaitan) your declaration was. Much less the origins of your eschatology that inspired the panic. Back when I was a futurist I was afraid to click on links like this too.

AN END TIME MYTH

You keep ignoring what I said. I am NOT saying that the Temple is where Christians are going to need to go and worship. It is the JEWS that are going to do it. They are wrong in not accepting Christ now, and will still be wrong when they go back to Temple worship and sacrifices. We know, from Scripture, that there is going to be another Temple. Here is a very clear reference to it:

2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

2 Thessalonians 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

This fits exactly with what Jesus was talking about here:

Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

And it also is what is talked about here:

Revelation 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

Revelation 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

Revelation 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

Revelation 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

You keep trying to fit me into some place I do not belong. You keep trying to force me into fitting these eight points you got from someone. Well, THEY DO NOT DESCRIBE WHAT I HAVE LEARNED FROM READING THE BIBLE AND DO NOT APPLY TO ME. Can you get that now? I have never read Darcy, nor any of the other people you think I might have. I HAVE READ THE BIBLE AND RECEIVED GUIDANCE FROM THE HOLY SPIRIT, and that's it. Nothing more to it, so quit trying to make me fit some mold you have gotten from reading some other guy. Try just reading the Scripture and asking for guidance from the Holy Spirit. When you really do that amazing things happen. The Scripture comes alive and become clear. It doesn't require any special training or reading a bunch of other people's writings on it, just the Bible and the Holy Spirit. You might want to try it sometime. You may see how far out there I left field the things you are saying really are when compared to Scripture.

In your original post you claimed to have somehow discovered all this through independent Bible study, but by now even you should be able to see it is all John Nelson Darby. No rebuilt temple would get anybody anywhere since it would be desolate before the first stone was laid because of Jesus' ONE sacrifice for sins forever.

Did you notice how you keep confirming the numbered points I credited to you, that you balked at? You practically summed them up in this reply alone! Let's review what your post suggests.

1. Exclude Jews from the new covenant?

2. Cheer on a restoration of the old covenant that waxed away?

3. Suggest that Jesus' one sacrifice for sins forever was somehow so insufficient, incomplete and unfinished, that a resumption of animal sacrifices in the future would be appropriate or sanctified for any reason?

4. Take salvation through the Gospel away from Jews when it was specifically given to the Jew first?

5. Denigrate the temple that Jesus built in three days, by cheering on a future physical temple, made with hands?

6. Believe that God would dwell in a temple made with hands?

7. Believe such a temple could ever be consecrated, to then be desolated, when our high priest is seated in the true tabernacle that the Lord pitched, and rules in His kingdom today?

8. Reject the kingdom of Jesus Christ that arrived in the first century, to cheer on some future carnal kingdom of the flesh on earth, when Jesus told us His kingdom is specifically not of this world and is within us?

Nor did you point out where SCRIPTURE talks about a rebuilt temple.

Here's what one of John Darby's most ardent supporters said of Darby's eschatological invention

"Throughout the writings of the apostle Paul he again and again refers to a wondrous secret, which he designates in a special way as "the mystery," or "the great mystery." Other mysteries he treats of, as we have seen, and shall notice later; but there is one that is preeminently such. It occupies much of his ministry, and is clearly the chief gem in the diadem of the truth of Christianity; yet for centuries it was almost entirely lost sight of. In fact, until brought to the fore through the writings and the preaching and teaching of a distinguished ex-clergyman, Mr. J. N. Darby, in the early part of the last century, it is scarcely to be found in a single book or sermon throughout a period of sixteen hundred years! If any doubt this statement, let them search, as the writer has in measure done, the remarks of the so-called Fathers, both pre- and post-Nicene; the theological treatises of the scholastic divines; Roman Catholic writers of all shades of thought; the literature of the Reformation; the sermons and expositions of the Puritans; and the general theological works of the day. He will find "the mystery" conspicuous by its absence. Of ordinances exalted to the place of mysteries, as in heathen rites, he will find much; but as to the mystery, which to the apostle was so unspeakably precious, rarely a reference!"

But how did Darby come up with it? It all began with a Roman Church Jesuit named Francisco Ribera's counter-reformation creation, invented to divert the reformers attention away from an understanding that the Roman Church was the "whore of Babylon" mentioned in the book of Revelation.

AN END TIME MYTH

The coming Temple is going to be a JEWISH Temple, for the JEWS, not a Christian Temple. They are going to go back to the Mosaic Law sacrificial system. We both know that Jesus negated that system on the cross. However, they don't accept that and are going to go back to it. That is the Temple that Scripture talks about briefly.

"Your equating the soon to be rebuilt Jewish Temple in Jerusalem with the Temple of God is where you err."

Talk about "gross error", your equating John Nelson Darby's inverted pyramid of pile-on presumption to scripture, is the error.

If not, where did you come up with the idea of a rebuilt temple in our future, through scripture?

Was Jesus' ONE sacrifice for sins FOREVER, through which He built our perfect temple, so imperfect, unfinished and incomplete, that there will need to be another temple and a resumption of the old covenant and a restoration of animal sacrifices to satisfy you?

Your equating the soon to be rebuilt Jewish Temple in Jerusalem (go see this site for more ~The Holy Temple in Jerusalem: Yesterday Tomorrow Today) with the Temple of God is where you err. They are going to do this, and soon. This is the Temple the AntiChrist is going to enter to perform the abomination of desecration. The Jews are going to continue in error by rejecting Christ, with their return to the Levitical sacrifices as the greatest expression of this, until this abomination occurs. That is when the scales will fall from their eyes and they will see the truth. So, by your reckoning, when was/will be the abomination of desecration and what was it/will it be?