Author Topic: The Reformers On Islam  (Read 3824 times)

PeteWaldo

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The Reformers On Islam
« on: January 26, 2014, 11:34:36 AM »
Being too busy and lazy to read all of the old commentaries, I have done searches form time to time, as I was certain that the reformers recognized Islam for what it is. This morning I did a search and a site popped up so easily after so many attempts, I wonder if I never tried this search before -  matthew henry islam -.
https://www.google.com/#q=matthew+henry+islam

I'd like to greatly expand this thread, and then include what we find in the historicist page at christianeschatology.com

http://www.whitehorsemedia.com/articles/?d=68#.UuU2prQo61s
"The Army of Locusts: What Are They?

So, what was John talking about when he described the army of locusts? A fleet of 21st-century military helicopters? Some modern-day teachers who promote trendy, pop interpretations of prophecy see nothing more than helicopters in these verses. Christians of the past, who know history better than most of us do, saw this army of locusts as a prophecy of the rise and spread of Islam. Writer Robert Wieland states that the Reformers “clearly recognized Islam” in this passage.[1] John Foxe, author of Foxe’s Book of Martyrs, said that it is “clearer than light itself” that this a prophecy of the Muslim conquests.[2]

“Well into the nineteenth century a chorus of Protestant prophetic scholars identified Islam’s niche in prophecy as being these fifth and sixth trumpets,” Wieland says.[3] Commentator Albert Barnes wrote: “With surprising unanimity, commentators have agreed in regarding this to the empire of the Saracens [Arab Muslims –DB], or to the rise and the progress of the religion and the empire set up by Muhammed.”[4]

Commentators may not agree with unanimity anymore, but many of the older commentators agree. W.B. Godbey began his comments on Revelation 9 by stating, “This chapter is a thrilling description of the rise and progress of the Mohammedan wars.”[5] Adam Clarke said that John’s description of the army of locusts “certainly agrees better with the Saracens than with any other people or nation” and “agrees very well with the troops of Mohammed.” [6] Matthew Henry referred to the army of locusts as “the armies of the Mohamedan empire.”[7] John Wesley said, “All this agrees with the slaughter which the Saracens made for a long time after Mahomet’s [Mohammed’s] death.” [8]

Let’s look at some of the details of John’s vision and see how it describes the rise and spread of Islam.

Out of the Abyss

The army of locusts came forth from a dark cloud of smoke that rolled out of the bottomless pit. The “bottomless pit” in Greek is abussos (abussoß), the source of our English word abyss. Some English Bibles simply translate it as “the abyss.” It is remarkable that Abul A’la Mawdudi, one of Islam’s most prominent scholars of the 20th century, used the very word abyss when writing about the beginnings of Islam. In a book written to introduce English-speaking people to the basics of Islam, Mawdudi tells his readers that Muhammed and his message came out of “Arabia – the Abyss of Darkness.” [9] These are his exact words, and they appear in bold print as a sub-heading in his book. It is no mere coincidence that this outstanding Islamic author unwittingly identified Islam’s source, in bold print no less, as “the Abyss of Darkness,” using the very same word that appears in Revelation.

Locusts in Arab Literature

Why an army of locusts to represent an army of Arabs? About 900 years before John’s Revelation, the Prophet Joel has symbolically described an invading, attacking army as a swarm of locusts. Any large, invading army might be compared to a swarm of locusts, but the Arabs and Muhammed have a unique connection to the locust: “In the Bedoween romance Antar, the locust is introduced as the national emblem of the Ishmaelites [one of the ancestors of the Arabs –DB]. And it is a remarkable coincidence that Muslim tradition speaks of locusts having dropped into the hands of Muhammed, bearing on their wings this inscription – ‘We are the army of the Great God.’”[10]

As we saw a Muslim writer unwittingly connect Islam’s beginnings to the Abyss, here we see Muslim writers unwittingly connect Islam to the locusts that come from the Abyss."

Here's another thread in this forum including a pretty good youtube video on Rev Chapter 9:
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1289.0

ExMilitary

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Re: The Reformers On Islam
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2014, 01:08:46 PM »
Being too busy and lazy to read all of the old commentaries, I have done searches form time to time, as I was certain that the reformers recognized Islam for what it is. This morning I did a search and a site popped up so easily, I wonder if I never tried this search before -  matthew henry islam -.
https://www.google.com/#q=matthew+henry+islam

I'd like to greatly expand this thread, and then include what we find in the historicist page at christianeschatology.com

http://www.whitehorsemedia.com/articles/?d=68#.UuU2prQo61s
"The Army of Locusts: What Are They?

So, what was John talking about when he described the army of locusts? A fleet of 21st-century military helicopters? Some modern-day teachers who promote trendy, pop interpretations of prophecy see nothing more than helicopters in these verses. Christians of the past, who know history better than most of us do, saw this army of locusts as a prophecy of the rise and spread of Islam. Writer Robert Wieland states that the Reformers “clearly recognized Islam” in this passage.[1] John Foxe, author of Foxe’s Book of Martyrs, said that it is “clearer than light itself” that this a prophecy of the Muslim conquests.[2]

“Well into the nineteenth century a chorus of Protestant prophetic scholars identified Islam’s niche in prophecy as being these fifth and sixth trumpets,” Wieland says.[3] Commentator Albert Barnes wrote: “With surprising unanimity, commentators have agreed in regarding this to the empire of the Saracens [Arab Muslims –DB], or to the rise and the progress of the religion and the empire set up by Muhammed.”[4]

Commentators may not agree with unanimity anymore, but many of the older commentators agree. W.B. Godbey began his comments on Revelation 9 by stating, “This chapter is a thrilling description of the rise and progress of the Mohammedan wars.”[5] Adam Clarke said that John’s description of the army of locusts “certainly agrees better with the Saracens than with any other people or nation” and “agrees very well with the troops of Mohammed.” [6] Matthew Henry referred to the army of locusts as “the armies of the Mohamedan empire.”[7] John Wesley said, “All this agrees with the slaughter which the Saracens made for a long time after Mahomet’s [Mohammed’s] death.” [8]

Let’s look at some of the details of John’s vision and see how it describes the rise and spread of Islam.

Out of the Abyss

The army of locusts came forth from a dark cloud of smoke that rolled out of the bottomless pit. The “bottomless pit” in Greek is abussos (abussoß), the source of our English word abyss. Some English Bibles simply translate it as “the abyss.” It is remarkable that Abul A’la Mawdudi, one of Islam’s most prominent scholars of the 20th century, used the very word abyss when writing about the beginnings of Islam. In a book written to introduce English-speaking people to the basics of Islam, Mawdudi tells his readers that Muhammed and his message came out of “Arabia – the Abyss of Darkness.” [9] These are his exact words, and they appear in bold print as a sub-heading in his book. It is no mere coincidence that this outstanding Islamic author unwittingly identified Islam’s source, in bold print no less, as “the Abyss of Darkness,” using the very same word that appears in Revelation.

Locusts in Arab Literature

Why an army of locusts to represent an army of Arabs? About 900 years before John’s Revelation, the Prophet Joel has symbolically described an invading, attacking army as a swarm of locusts. Any large, invading army might be compared to a swarm of locusts, but the Arabs and Muhammed have a unique connection to the locust: “In the Bedoween romance Antar, the locust is introduced as the national emblem of the Ishmaelites [one of the ancestors of the Arabs –DB]. And it is a remarkable coincidence that Muslim tradition speaks of locusts having dropped into the hands of Muhammed, bearing on their wings this inscription – ‘We are the army of the Great God.’”[10]

As we saw a Muslim writer unwittingly connect Islam’s beginnings to the Abyss, here we see Muslim writers unwittingly connect Islam to the locusts that come from the Abyss."

My concern is this, nearly the entire globe is being enrolled into a giant right-to-buy-or-sell database.  We are actually entering a time when you must either choose to fear the beast or choose poverty.

Take this one example, for instance.  In order to obtain a job in the United States of America, you and your employer are required to fill out a form I-9.  You cannot complete the I-9 without receiving photo ID from a government agency.  You cannot obtain photo ID from a government agency without allowing them to evaluate to biometrically catalog you in a federal database.  Why do they need to catalog you?  The 9/11 Commission Report got the ball rolling on 'REAL ID' to fight terrorism.

Senate testimony by the former chairman of the 9/11 commission:

"Eighteen of the nineteen 9/11 hijackers obtained 30 state-issued IDs amongst them that enabled them to more easily board planes on the morning of 9/11. Due to the ease with which fraud was used to obtain legitimate IDs that helped the hijackers embed and assimilate in the U.S. for the purpose of carrying out a terrorist act, the 9/11 Commission recommended that ‘The federal government should set standards for the issuance of birth certificates and sources of identification, such as driver’s licenses.’ The REAL ID Act established these standards by statute. In 2008, detailed regulations were issued setting standards and benchmarks for driver’s license issuance..."

From the DHS web page:

"Raising the standards of state-issued identification is an important step toward enhancing national security. Because a driver’s license serves so many purposes (access to federal buildings and nuclear power plants, boarding aircraft, etc.), criminals and terrorists actively seek fraudulent state-issued identification. States that implement measures to increase their documents’ security make it more difficult for criminals to obtain these documents, while making it easier for law enforcement to detect falsified documents."

And DHS is just outright lying on their web page when they say the following:

REAL ID does not apply to the following:
Voting or registering to vote
Applying for or receiving Federal benefits
Being licensed by a state to drive
Accessing Health or life preserving services (including hospitals and health clinics), law enforcement, or constitutionally protected activities (including a defendant’s access to court proceedings)

I just checked in the state where I live, New Mexico, and you MUST have presented your REAL ID to someone in order to register to vote.

In New Mexico, where I live, you cannot get a driver's license that isn't REAL ID compliant.  There are no alternatives.  Although the federal government doesn't require REAL ID enforcement for the above list of things, they'll only fund REAL ID compliant processes.  For instance, in order for NM to have an alternative licensing process that wasn't REAL ID compliant, they would have to have another set of photo cameras at every DMV location in the state.  Now, what state, in their right economic minds, would purposely double their costs to accommodate the VERY FEW that do not want to be part of 'the system'?

The snare is set.  The net is being drawn.  Like the Lord said, "...shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them? I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?"

PeteWaldo

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Re: The Reformers On Islam
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2014, 02:19:12 PM »
My concern is this, nearly the entire globe is being enrolled into a giant right-to-buy-or-sell database.  We are actually entering a time when you must either choose to fear the beast or choose poverty.

But through an ethnographic hermeneutic of John's "whole world" - viewing John's whole world through John's 1st century eyes - this is already fulfilled prophecy. Particularly as we witness the last of the non-Muslim remnant being persecuted and wiped out:

Strong's
 
(link) world
New Testament Greek Definition:
3625 oikoumene {oy-kou-men'-ay}
feminine participle present passive of 3611 (as noun, by
implication of 1093); TDNT - 5:157,674; n f
AV - world 14, earth 1; 15
1) the inhabited earth
1a) the portion of the earth inhabited by the Greeks, in
distinction from the lands of the barbarians
1b) the Roman empire, all the subjects of the empire

1c) the whole inhabited earth, the world
1d) the inhabitants of the earth, men
2) the universe, the world


PeteWaldo

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Re: The Reformers On Islam
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2014, 09:31:20 AM »
http://www.christianeschatology.com/historicism.htm#christians_on_islam

Of Revelation chapter 9:  John Foxe who authored Foxe’s Book of Martyrs wrote that it is “clearer than light itself” as being a prophecy of the Muslim conquests.

Albert Barnes: “With surprising unanimity, commentators have agreed in regarding this to the empire of the Saracens (Muslims), or to the rise and the progress of the religion and the empire set up by Muhammed.”

W.B. Godbey: “This chapter is a thrilling description of the rise and progress of the Mohammedan wars.”

Of the locusts of Revelation 9:  Adam Clarke: “certainly agrees better with the Saracens than with any other people or nation” and “agrees very well with the troops of Mohammed.”

Matthew Henry: “the armies of the Mohamedan empire.”

John Wesley: “All this agrees with the slaughter which the Saracens made for a long time after Mahomet’s death.”