Author Topic: Re: The first Suicide Soldier  (Read 30843 times)

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« on: October 19, 2010, 03:33:13 PM »
Something puzzles me when I read the story of Samson who was born to aged parents. He was a Nazirite set apart for God's service and therefore did not cut his hair or drink alcohol. His exploits included tearing a lion apart with his bare hands, killing a company of the men of Ashdod, setting fire to their fields and orchards, and slaughtering a thousand men with the jawbone of an ass. After a Philistine woman named Delilah enticed Samson to reveal the secret of his great strength, she cut off his hair, and the Philistines gouged out his eyes, bound him with strong fetters, and set him to grind at the mill in the prison. But Samson's hair, the secret of his strength, began to grow again. The day came when the Philistine lords sent for the blind Samson to laugh at him. Samson felt for the pillars on which the house rested, pulled them down, and died along with many Philistines.

Was this the first suicide matyr?

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2010, 03:39:14 PM »
Something puzzles me when I read the story of Samson who was born to aged parents. He was a Nazirite set apart for God's service and therefore did not cut his hair or drink alcohol. His exploits included tearing a lion apart with his bare hands, killing a company of the men of Ashdod, setting fire to their fields and orchards, and slaughtering a thousand men with the jawbone of an ass. After a Philistine woman named Delilah enticed Samson to reveal the secret of his great strength, she cut off his hair, and the Philistines gouged out his eyes, bound him with strong fetters, and set him to grind at the mill in the prison. But Samson's hair, the secret of his strength, began to grow again. The day came when the Philistine lords sent for the blind Samson to laugh at him. Samson felt for the pillars on which the house rested, pulled them down, and died along with many Philistines.

Was this the first suicide matyr?

Hi Mujaheed, and welcome to the forum! :)
I think the consensus vote for first martyr would likely be for Able. His brother Cain the first murderer.
Whoops correction. I didn't read your post very carefully. Sorry.
If by "suicide martyr" you mean someone that dies with intent while in the act of murdering innocents, or dies inadvertently while engaged in imperialistic conquest, there is no such thing.

For example a Christian martyr would say "I will die for what I believe in."
A Muslim so-called martyr says "You will die for what I believe in."

Here are examples of a few martyrs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA
Here's a book full of more "FOX's BOOK of MARTYRS"
http://www.ccel.org/f/foxe/martyrs/home.html

As contrasted to this YouTube with a few examples of failed would-be suicide murderers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA

Again, welcome to the forum Mujaheed.

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2010, 06:32:00 PM »
Something puzzles me when I read the story of Samson who was born to aged parents. He was a Nazirite set apart for God's service and therefore did not cut his hair or drink alcohol. His exploits included tearing a lion apart with his bare hands, killing a company of the men of Ashdod, setting fire to their fields and orchards, and slaughtering a thousand men with the jawbone of an ass. After a Philistine woman named Delilah enticed Samson to reveal the secret of his great strength, she cut off his hair, and the Philistines gouged out his eyes, bound him with strong fetters, and set him to grind at the mill in the prison. But Samson's hair, the secret of his strength, began to grow again. The day came when the Philistine lords sent for the blind Samson to laugh at him. Samson felt for the pillars on which the house rested, pulled them down, and died along with many Philistines.

Was this the first suicide matyr?

Hi Mujaheed, and welcome to the forum! :)
I think the consensus vote for first martyr would likely be for Able. His brother Cain the first murderer.
Whoops correction. I didn't read your post very carefully. Sorry.
If by "suicide martyr" you mean someone that dies with intent while in the act of murdering innocents, or dies inadvertently while engaged in imperialistic conquest, there is no such thing.

For example a Christian martyr would say "I will die for what I believe in."

DID EVERYONE NOT DIE FOR WHAT SMSON BELIEVED IN< even worse was he avenging himself and will he go to heaven?
A Muslim so-called martyr says "You will die for what I believe in."

Here are examples of a few martyrs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA
Here's a book full of more "FOX's BOOK of MARTYRS"
http://www.ccel.org/f/foxe/martyrs/home.html

As contrasted to this YouTube with a few examples of failed would-be suicide murderers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA

Again, welcome to the forum Mujaheed.

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2010, 08:14:34 PM »
There are instructions on quoting here
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=39.0

Otherwise just leave the first and last tag, for example the top tag like this
[ quote author=Peter link=topic=1899.msg7864#msg7864 date=1287533674 ]
and remove everything you don't want before the last tag that looks like this 
[/quote]
then type after that last tag.

Don't be afraid to chop it up into pieces.


Regarding your question,
"DID EVERYONE NOT DIE FOR WHAT SMSON BELIEVED IN< even worse was he avenging himself and will he go to heaven?"

It's late and I'm tired and am too unfamiliar with the story offhand to answer just yet. Besides it's an unimportant and unnecessary distraction from the content of the post. We have much larger topics to cover. Please address the rest of the points in the post. Can you see the difference between Christian martyrs and Islam's so-called martyrs?

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2010, 04:52:23 AM »
Regarding your question,
"DID EVERYONE NOT DIE FOR WHAT SMSON BELIEVED IN< even worse was he avenging himself and will he go to heaven?"

It's late and I'm tired and am too unfamiliar with the story offhand to answer just yet. Besides it's an unimportant and unnecessary distraction from the content of the post. We have much larger topics to cover. Please address the rest of the points in the post. Can you see the difference between Christian martyrs and Islam's so-called martyrs?
[/quote]
I'm confused by your response, the GOD of Love was always the GOD of LOVE? or GOD only loved us when Jesus was created in his mothers womb? or only loved mankind enough when Jesus was born or when He was ascended into the Heavens? So where was GOD when Samson of the Blble committed suicide?
You did request that I read the Bible (translated from the greek word biblios simply meaning book) and I happen to open it on the Chapters Judges, the Judge of Judges, and if the Book (BIBLE IN GREEK) is your yardstick you should be familiar with all its passages, I dont expect you to know them as well as a muslim Hafiz does, but at least know of the most famous of Sunday school Stories of Samson and Delilah, a major issue that seems to be conveniently forgotten or does it highlight the origin of Suicide missions for the people of the Book?

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2010, 05:43:22 AM »
Regarding your question,
"DID EVERYONE NOT DIE FOR WHAT SMSON BELIEVED IN< even worse was he avenging himself and will he go to heaven?"

It's late and I'm tired and am too unfamiliar with the story offhand to answer just yet. Besides it's an unimportant and unnecessary distraction from the content of the post. We have much larger topics to cover. Please address the rest of the points in the post. Can you see the difference between Christian martyrs and Islam's so-called martyrs?
I'm confused by your response, the GOD of Love was always the GOD of LOVE?

My second advice regarding quoting was not good.
Please follow the quoting instructions. They aren't that complicated.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=39.0

I don't believe you are really confused as much as desiring to avoid my question regarding the difference between Christian and Muslim martyrs.
Muslims can't understand what a martyr really is because of the Quran. Mohammed suggested that a martyr is someone who inadvertently is killed while in the act of murdering others during imperialistic conquest.

When aggressors attack peaceful people that are minding their own business, and then one of the attackers happens to be killed because one of the innocent people being attacked acts in his own and his family's self-defense, do you believe that makes the dead aggressor a martyr?

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2010, 06:16:27 AM »
or GOD only loved us when Jesus was created in his mothers womb? or only loved mankind enough when Jesus was born or when He was ascended into the Heavens? So where was GOD when Samson of the Blble committed suicide?
You did request that I read the Bible (translated from the greek word biblios simply meaning book) and I happen to open it on the Chapters Judges, the Judge of Judges, and if the Book (BIBLE IN GREEK) is your yardstick you should be familiar with all its passages, I dont expect you to know them as well as a muslim Hafiz does, but at least know of the most famous of Sunday school Stories of Samson and Delilah, a major issue that seems to be conveniently forgotten or does it highlight the origin of Suicide missions for the people of the Book?

Did Samson set out that morning with a plan to pull pillars down, and was his objective to kill innocent people?

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2010, 07:53:40 AM »
Did Samson set out that morning with a plan to pull pillars down, and was his objective to kill innocent people?
[/quote]

For your convenience I copy and paste the story of Samson as told in the King James Version of the Bible, copied from Bible gateway, I highlight the killing part for you.

4And Samson went and caught three hundred foxes, and took firebrands, and turned tail to tail, and put a firebrand in the midst between two tails.

 5And when he had set the brands on fire, he let them go into the standing corn of the Philistines, and burnt up both the shocks, and also the standing corn, with the vineyards and olives.

 6Then the Philistines said, Who hath done this? And they answered, Samson, the son in law of the Timnite, because he had taken his wife, and given her to his companion. And the Philistines came up, and burnt her and her father with fire.

 7And Samson said unto them, Though ye have done this, yet will I be avenged of you, and after that I will cease.

 8And he smote them hip and thigh with a great slaughter: and he went down and dwelt in the top of the rock Etam.

 9Then the Philistines went up, and pitched in Judah, and spread themselves in Lehi.

 10And the men of Judah said, Why are ye come up against us? And they answered, To bind Samson are we come up, to do to him as he hath done to us.

 11Then three thousand men of Judah went to the top of the rock Etam, and said to Samson, Knowest thou not that the Philistines are rulers over us? what is this that thou hast done unto us? And he said unto them, As they did unto me, so have I done unto them.

 12And they said unto him, We are come down to bind thee, that we may deliver thee into the hand of the Philistines. And Samson said unto them, Swear unto me, that ye will not fall upon me yourselves.

 13And they spake unto him, saying, No; but we will bind thee fast, and deliver thee into their hand: but surely we will not kill thee. And they bound him with two new cords, and brought him up from the rock.

 14And when he came unto Lehi, the Philistines shouted against him: and the Spirit of the LORD came mightily upon him, and the cords that were upon his arms became as flax that was burnt with fire, and his bands loosed from off his hands.

 15And he found a new jawbone of an ass, and put forth his hand, and took it, and slew a thousand men therewith.

 16And Samson said, With the jawbone of an ass, heaps upon heaps, with the jaw of an ass have I slain a thousand men.


 17And it came to pass, when he had made an end of speaking, that he cast away the jawbone out of his hand, and called that place Ramathlehi.

 18And he was sore athirst, and called on the LORD, and said, Thou hast given this great deliverance into the hand of thy servant: and now shall I die for thirst, and fall into the hand of the uncircumcised?

 19But God clave an hollow place that was in the jaw, and there came water thereout; and when he had drunk, his spirit came again, and he revived: wherefore he called the name thereof Enhakkore, which is in Lehi unto this day.

 20And he judged Israel in the days of the Philistines twenty years.


Apparently Your GOD "the Spirit of the Lord" helped him kill a thousand men.

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2010, 08:30:59 AM »
Apparently Your GOD "the Spirit of the Lord" helped him kill a thousand men.

This isn't be the only lesson taught, during the early revelation of God, to early man (in this case of the book of Judges spanning from about 1400-1100 BC). In this case to the Philistines paid for their oppression of the tribe of Judah, of whom God appointed and strengthened Samson as Israel's deliverer.

The same kind of lesson is prophesied in the Old Testament for the people of the Islamic "beast" at final judgment.

Zechariah 12:8 In that day shall the LORD defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as David; and the house of David [shall be] as God, as the angel of the LORD before them. 9And it shall come to pass in that day, [that] I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

And for the faithful but still sovereignly blinded Jews in Jerusalem?

10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for [his] only [son], and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for [his] firstborn.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=331.0

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2010, 08:33:15 AM »
Perhaps now you can answer my question.

When aggressors attack peaceful people that are minding their own business and then one of the attackers happens to get killed, because one of the innocent people being attacked acts in his own and his family's self-defense, do you believe that makes the dead aggressor a martyr?

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2010, 09:25:45 AM »
Perhaps now you can answer my question.

When aggressors attack peaceful people that are minding their own business and then one of the attackers happens to get killed, because one of the innocent people being attacked acts in his own and his family's self-defense, do you believe that makes the dead aggressor a martyr?

You digress,and asking me sit in judgement without the full story, If an Innocent person is killed it is as if you have killed the entire humanity (Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him) Unprovoked attacks is prohibited and the Scripture clearly defines the boundaries of a human being as an individual and in terms of his participation in society and in relation to the rest of humanity.

I am not sure where you heading with this new line but you seem to be avoiding the Story of Samson and Delilah completely since the beginning of this post.

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2010, 09:51:40 AM »
Perhaps now you can answer my question.

When aggressors attack peaceful people that are minding their own business and then one of the attackers happens to get killed, because one of the innocent people being attacked acts in his own and his family's self-defense, do you believe that makes the dead aggressor a martyr?

You digress,and asking me sit in judgement without the full story, ..........

"When aggressors attack peaceful people that are minding their own business and then one of the attackers happens to get killed, because one of the innocent people being attacked acts in his own and his family's self-defense, do you believe that makes the dead aggressor a martyr?"

What part of the story is missing?
Whether the imperialistic murderous aggressors were Mohammed's followers or not?

.......... If an Innocent person .........

Folks in this forum didn't just fall off of the turnip truck.
What non-Muslim do Muslims consider innocent? Do you even judge Shiites as being innocent?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maHSOB2RFm4

....... is killed it is as if you have killed the entire humanity (Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him) Unprovoked attacks is prohibited and the Scripture clearly defines the boundaries of a human being as an individual and in terms of his participation in society and in relation to the rest of humanity.

Then how do you explain the rape, pillage and plunder of the Islamic imperialist conquest not only throughout Arabia, but all the way up to Tours France and Vienna Austria?

How do you explain the over 2 million killed in the Sudan alone?

How do you explain the over 16,000 deadly Islamic terror attacks, around the world, just since 9-11?
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=731.0

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2010, 10:26:50 AM »
I am not sure where you heading with this new line but you seem to be avoiding the Story of Samson and Delilah completely since the beginning of this post.

Not at all. In my prior post I told you that Samson was engaged in God's service to Israel.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7884#msg7884
That he died in the process would make him a martyr - not a suicide martyr. Samson didn't set out with a plan to commit suicide while liberating the Israelites.

You could have seen this for yourself if you hadn't ignored my prior question.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7872#msg7872

"Did Samson set out that morning with a plan to pull pillars down, and was his objective to kill innocent people?"

Here's another.
Was Samson on a mission of Islamic style imperialistic conquest with the goal of oppressing those he vanquished, or was his mission one of liberation of the Israelites, from their oppressors?

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2010, 10:43:37 AM »
Now let's see if you can discern the difference between a Christian and a Muslim martyr yet.

An Islamic "suicide martyr" begins with a plan, fully intending to commit suicide, while in the act of murdering innocent people.
Another Islam styled "martyr" dies inadvertently while engaged in imperialistic conquest and slaughter of innocents.

A Christian martyr on the other hand would say "I will die for what I believe in."
An Islamic so-called martyr says "You will die for what I believe in."

Here's a YouTube of examples of a few Christian martyrs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA
Here's a book full of martyrs "FOX's BOOK of MARTYRS"
http://www.ccel.org/f/foxe/martyrs/home.html
And another "Martyr's Mirror"
http://www.homecomers.org/mirror/

As contrasted to this YouTube with the words of a few examples of failed would-be Islamic suicide murderers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #14 on: October 20, 2010, 11:28:48 AM »
Perhaps now you can answer my question.

When aggressors attack peaceful people that are minding their own business and then one of the attackers happens to get killed, because one of the innocent people being attacked acts in his own and his family's self-defense, do you believe that makes the dead aggressor a martyr?

You digress,and asking me sit in judgement without the full story, If an Innocent person is killed it is as if you have killed the entire humanity (Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him) Unprovoked attacks is prohibited and the Scripture clearly defines the boundaries of a human being as an individual and in terms of his participation in society and in relation to the rest of humanity.

I am not sure where you heading with this new line but you seem to be avoiding the Story of Samson and Delilah completely since the beginning of this post.

When Christians attack innocent people and one of them die of course they are not martyrs, and aggressor is not a martyr.

Anyone dying in the crusades is obviously not a martyr, there are no unprovoked attacks in Islamic history by the Prophet Muhammad or his companions or those generations that followed him until the end of the khaliphate in 1902 that I am aware of. The spread of Islam did not happen at the edge of the sword as you so misleading state everytime this subject comes up

Did Samson set out to commit suicide, he prayed to GOD TO KILL HIM, You obviously have selected verses to Read from the OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT, I deliberately left out the second half of the story to see if you repeat your unfounded misguided question from your own intellect here is the proof he committed suicide

25 While they were in high spirits, they shouted, "Bring out Samson to entertain us." So they called Samson out of the prison, and he performed for them.
      When they stood him among the pillars, 26 Samson said to the servant who held his hand, "Put me where I can feel the pillars that support the temple, so that I may lean against them." 27 Now the temple was crowded with men and women; all the rulers of the Philistines were there, and on the roof were about three thousand men and women watching Samson perform. 28 Then Samson prayed to the LORD, "O Sovereign LORD, remember me. O God, please strengthen me just once more, and let me with one blow get revenge on the Philistines for my two eyes." 29 Then Samson reached toward the two central pillars on which the temple stood. Bracing himself against them, his right hand on the one and his left hand on the other, 30 Samson said, "Let me die with the Philistines!" Then he pushed with all his might, and down came the temple on the rulers and all the people in it. Thus he killed many more when he died than while he lived.

What astounds me is that you are so hell bent on insulting and telling lies about the most respected, trustworthy and honorable man (MUHAMMAD may ALLAH bestow peace upon him) by any standard and you fail to read your own bible carefully that contains all the murder mayhem incest, suicides, fornicating with prostitutes and stories filled with false charges and accusations against the prophets of GOD by godless politicians that has set out to destroy the LAW OF THE one and only GOD (ALLAH).

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #15 on: October 20, 2010, 01:35:23 PM »
Perhaps now you can answer my question.

When aggressors attack peaceful people that are minding their own business and then one of the attackers happens to get killed, because one of the innocent people being attacked acts in his own and his family's self-defense, do you believe that makes the dead aggressor a martyr?

You digress,and asking me sit in judgement without the full story, If an Innocent person is killed it is as if you have killed the entire humanity (Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him) Unprovoked attacks is prohibited and the Scripture clearly defines the boundaries of a human being as an individual and in terms of his participation in society and in relation to the rest of humanity.

I am not sure where you heading with this new line but you seem to be avoiding the Story of Samson and Delilah completely since the beginning of this post.

When Christians attack innocent people ......

Christians don't target for murder or attack innocent people.

...... and one of them die of course they are not martyrs, and aggressor is not a martyr.

Anyone dying in the crusades is obviously not a martyr, .......

There are at least a dozen parallels between the Roman Church and Islam.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=512.0

With both of them being murderers of Christians.

........ there are no unprovoked attacks in Islamic history by the Prophet Muhammad or his companions or those generations that followed him until the end of the khaliphate in 1902 that I am aware of.

Then explain Islamic imperialistic conquest all the way up to France and Austria.
Explain the 16,000 deadly Islamic terror attacks just since 9-11.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=731.0

I don't ask these things just to be ignored.

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #16 on: October 20, 2010, 01:35:56 PM »
The spread of Islam did not happen at the edge of the sword as you so misleading state everytime this subject comes up.

From Mohammed's return to Medina and threats against the Quraish. To outright slaughter of peaceful hardworking farmers.

Tabari VIII:35/Ishaq:464 "The Jews were made to come down, and Allah's Messenger imprisoned them. Then the Prophet went out into the marketplace of Medina (it is still its marketplace today), and he had trenches dug in it. He sent for the Jewish men and had them beheaded in those trenches. They were brought out to him in batches. They numbered 800 to 900 boys and men."

And rape of their wives.

Ishaq:466 "The Apostle [taking first dibs]  chose one of the Jewish women for himself. Her name was Rayhana. She remained with him until she died, in his power. The Apostle proposed to marry her and put the veil on her but she said, 'Leave me under your power, for that will be easier.' She showed a repugnance towards Islam when she was captured."
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1528.0

Surely you aren't going to claim that this slaughter of innocent boys and men isn't one of the proudest moments in Islamic history.

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #17 on: October 20, 2010, 01:40:12 PM »
"The Sword is the key  of heaven and hell; a drop of blood shed in the cause of Allah, a night spent in arms, is of more avail than two months of fasting and prayer; whoever falls in battle, his sins are forgiven, and at the day of judgment his limbs shall be supplied by the wings of angels and cherubim."

Sure! Islam "defended" itself all the way up to France and Austria!

623 - Battle of Waddan
623 - Battle of Safwan
623 - Battle of Dul-Ashir
624 - Muhammad and converts begin raids on caravans to fund the movement.
624 - Zakat becomes mandatory
624 - Battle of Badr
624 - Battle of Bani Salim
624 - Battle of Eid-ul-Fitr and Zakat-ul-Fitr
624 - Battle of Bani Qainuqa
624 - Battle of Sawiq
624 - Battle of Ghatfan
624 - Battle of Bahran
625 - Battle of Uhud. 70 Muslims are killed.
625 - Battle of Humra-ul-Asad
625 - Battle of Banu Nudair
625 - Battle of Dhatur-Riqa
626 - Battle of Badru-Ukhra
626 - Battle of Dumatul-Jandal
626 - Battle of Banu Mustalaq Nikah
627 - Battle of the Trench
627 - Battle of Ahzab
627 - Battle of Bani Quraiza
627 - Battle of Bani Lahyan
627 - Battle of Ghaiba
627 - Battle of Khaibar
628 - Muhammad signs treaty with Quraish.
630 - Muhammad conquers Mecca.
630 - Battle of Hunsin.
630 - Battle of Tabuk
632 - Muhammad dies.
632 - Abu-Bakr, Muhammads father-in-law, along with Umar, begin a military move to enforce Islam in Arabia.
633 - Battle at Oman
633 - Battle at Hadramaut.
633 - Battle of Kazima
633 - Battle of Walaja
633 - Battle of Ulleis
633 - Battle of Anbar
634 - Battle of Basra,
634 - Battle of Damascus
634 - Battle of Ajnadin.
634 - Death of Hadrat Abu Bakr. Hadrat Umar Farooq becomes the Caliph.
634 - Battle of Namaraq
634 - Battle of Saqatia.
635 - Battle of Bridge.
635 - Battle of Buwaib.
635 - Conquest of Damascus.
635 - Battle of Fahl.
636 - Battle of Yermuk.
636 - Battle of Qadsiyia.
636 - Conquest of Madain.
637 - Battle of Jalula.
638 - Battle of Yarmouk.
638 - The Muslims defeat the Romans and enter Jerusalem.
638 - Conquest of Jazirah.
639 - Conquest of Khuizistan and movement into Egypt.
641 - Battle of Nihawand
642 - Battle of Ray in Persia
643 - Conquest of Azarbaijan
644 - Conquest of Fars
644 - Conquest of Kharan.
644 - Umar is murdered. Othman becomes the Caliph.
647 - Conquest of the island of Cypress
644 - Uman dies and is succeeded by Caliph Uthman.
648 - Campaign against the Byzantines.
651 - Naval battle against the Byzantines.
654 - Islam spreads into North Africa
656 - Uthman is murdered. Ali become Caliph.
658 - Battle of Nahrawan.
659 - Conquest of Egypt
661 - Ali is murdered.
662 - Egypt falls to Islam rule.
666 - Sicily is attacked by Muslims
677 - Siege of Constantinople
687 - Battle of Kufa
691 - Battle of Deir ul Jaliq
700 - Sufism takes root as a sect of Islam
700 - Military campaigns in North Africa
702 - Battle of Deir ul Jamira
711 - Muslims invade Gibraltar
711 - Conquest of Spain
713 - Conquest of Multan
716 - Invasion of Constantinople
732 - Battle of Tours in France.
740 - Battle of the Nobles.
741 - Battle of Bagdoura in North Africa
744 - Battle of Ain al Jurr.
746 - Battle of Rupar Thutha
748 - Battle of Rayy.
749 - Battle of lsfahan
749 - Battle of Nihawand
750 - Battle of Zab
772 - Battle of Janbi in North Africa
777 - Battle of Saragossa in Spain

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #18 on: October 20, 2010, 01:54:37 PM »
The spread of Islam did not happen at the edge of the sword as you so misleading state everytime this subject comes up.

From Mohammed's return to Medina and threats against the Quraish. To outright slaughter of peaceful hardworking farmers.

Tabari VIII:35/Ishaq:464 "The Jews were made to come down, and Allah's Messenger imprisoned them. Then the Prophet went out into the marketplace of Medina (it is still its marketplace today), and he had trenches dug in it. He sent for the Jewish men and had them beheaded in those trenches. They were brought out to him in batches. They numbered 800 to 900 boys and men."



Let me tell you the whole story as you dont seem to do that anywhere in this website, half truths and full lies is your style, aimed at misleading as is the trend amongst the scribes and pharisees that do not wish to obey the commands of the Prophets.

Battle of the Trench (Ghazwah al-Khandaq)

In 627, the Quraish (the chief aggressors towards Muhammad) decided to go against the Prophet Muhammad once again, after failing at the battles of Badr and Uhud. The level of duplicity in which Banu Qurayza dealt with these circumstances varies with reports, but whether or not it was responsible for instigating the confrontation between the Quraish and Muhammad or merely betrayed the Prophet they did openly align themselves with the Quraishi campaign . This act of treason was designed to encompass the Muslims in battles on all sides, one that would eventually fail them.

After the siege ended, the Quraish defeated again, Banu Qurayza were left alone to face the Muslims they betrayed (going against virtually every principle outlined within the Covenant of Medina). Forced to surrender, the leader of Banu Qurayza was asked “Will you be satisfied, o Aus, if one of your own number pronounces judgement on them? When they agreed he said that Sa'd b. Mu'adh was the man...Sa'd said, Then I give judgement that the men should be killed, the property divide, and the women and children taken as captives.”

This incident if often recounted as the mass slaughter of between 800-1000 ‘innocent’ Jews, and is given credence as being documented by a Muslim historian. The events are often twisted and manipulated, however, when one looks deeper it becomes clear that there were extenuating circumstances.

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2010, 01:54:51 PM »
Perhaps now you can answer my question.

When aggressors attack peaceful people that are minding their own business and then one of the attackers happens to get killed, because one of the innocent people being attacked acts in his own and his family's self-defense, do you believe that makes the dead aggressor a martyr?

You digress,and asking me sit in judgement without the full story, If an Innocent person is killed it is as if you have killed the entire humanity (Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him) Unprovoked attacks is prohibited and the Scripture clearly defines the boundaries of a human being as an individual and in terms of his participation in society and in relation to the rest of humanity.

I am not sure where you heading with this new line but you seem to be avoiding the Story of Samson and Delilah completely since the beginning of this post.

When Christians attack innocent people and one of them die of course they are not martyrs, and aggressor is not a martyr.

Anyone dying in the crusades is obviously not a martyr, there are no unprovoked attacks in Islamic history by the Prophet Muhammad or his companions or those generations that followed him until the end of the khaliphate in 1902 that I am aware of. The spread of Islam did not happen at the edge of the sword as you so misleading state everytime this subject comes up

Did Samson set out to commit suicide, he prayed to GOD TO KILL HIM, You obviously have selected verses to Read from the OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT, I deliberately left out the second half of the story to see if you repeat your unfounded misguided question from your own intellect here is the proof he committed suicide

25 While they were in high spirits, they shouted, "Bring out Samson to entertain us." So they called Samson out of the prison, and he performed for them.
      When they stood him among the pillars, 26 Samson said to the servant who held his hand, "Put me where I can feel the pillars that support the temple, so that I may lean against them." 27 Now the temple was crowded with men and women; all the rulers of the Philistines were there, and on the roof were about three thousand men and women watching Samson perform. 28 Then Samson prayed to the LORD, "O Sovereign LORD, remember me. O God, please strengthen me just once more, and let me with one blow get revenge on the Philistines for my two eyes." 29 Then Samson reached toward the two central pillars on which the temple stood. Bracing himself against them, his right hand on the one and his left hand on the other, 30 Samson said, "Let me die with the Philistines!" Then he pushed with all his might, and down came the temple on the rulers and all the people in it. Thus he killed many more when he died than while he lived.

What astounds me is that you are so hell bent on insulting and telling lies about the most respected, trustworthy and honorable man (MUHAMMAD may ALLAH bestow peace upon him) by any standard and you fail to read your own bible carefully that contains all the murder mayhem incest, suicides, fornicating with prostitutes and stories filled with false charges and accusations against the prophets of GOD by godless politicians that has set out to destroy the LAW OF THE one and only GOD (ALLAH).

It is you that fails to acknowledge the difference even though it was shown to you.

Samson was appointed and strengthened by God to liberate the Israleis from their Philistine oppressors. Samson didn't engage in that responsibility with the goal of suicide. That was a decision he made during the circumstances that presented themselves. Like when a soldier covers an Islamic reprobate's IED with his body, to save his friends from the blast.

Muslim suicide murderers plan their suicide along with their plan to slaughter innocent people.

Mohammed's reprobate imperialistic conquests had the exact opposite goal of Samson's.
Rather than the freeing oppressed people by engaging their oppressors, Mohammed's goal was the subjugation and oppression of people through imperialistic conquest, and bending them to his will, just as Islam's goal still stands today.
Just as practiced in Islamic countries today.
Just like the 2 million killed today - in the Sudan alone.
Let alone the terror inflicted through over 16,000 deadly Islamic terror attacks around the world, just since 9-11.

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2010, 01:58:01 PM »

Can you discern the difference between a Christian and a Muslim martyr yet?

An Islamic "suicide martyr" begins with a plan, fully intending to commit suicide, while in the act of murdering innocent people.
Another Islam styled "martyr" dies inadvertently while engaged in imperialistic conquest and slaughter of innocents.

A Christian martyr on the other hand would say "I will die for what I believe in."
An Islamic so-called martyr says "You will die for what I believe in."

Here's a YouTube of examples of a few Christian martyrs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA
Here's a book full of martyrs "FOX's BOOK of MARTYRS"
http://www.ccel.org/f/foxe/martyrs/home.html
And another "Martyr's Mirror"
http://www.homecomers.org/mirror/

As contrasted to this YouTube with the words of a few examples of failed would-be Islamic suicide murderers, and the reward they were seeking in Mohammed's chicken and wine serving bordello he called "paradise".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #21 on: October 20, 2010, 02:11:05 PM »
Can you discern the difference between a Christian and a Muslim martyr yet?

An Islamic "suicide martyr" begins with a plan, fully intending to commit suicide, while in the act of murdering innocent people.
Another Islam styled "martyr" dies inadvertently while engaged in imperialistic conquest and slaughter of innocents.

A Christian martyr on the other hand would say "I will die for what I believe in."
An Islamic so-called martyr says "You will die for what I believe in."

Here's a YouTube of examples of a few Christian martyrs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA

Peter you are so confused by the BIBLE scholars, the media the deviants the terrorists and all those that are dtermined to break every command of GOD ALMIGHTY>
YOU SWING FROM ONE THING TO THE NEXT LIKE A FULL BLOWN ADD SUFFERER>
I am trying to keep you focussed on one thing

Answer my very first question, DO YOU THINK SAMSON IS THE FIRST SUICIDE MATYR?

Here's a book full of martyrs "FOX's BOOK of MARTYRS"
http://www.ccel.org/f/foxe/martyrs/home.html
And another "Martyr's Mirror"
http://www.homecomers.org/mirror/

As contrasted to this YouTube with the words of a few examples of failed would-be Islamic suicide murderers, and the reward they were seeking in Mohammed's chicken and wine serving bordello he called "paradise".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA

Peter

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #22 on: October 20, 2010, 02:16:14 PM »
Peter you are so confused by the BIBLE scholars, the media the deviants the terrorists and all those that are dtermined to break every command of GOD ALMIGHTY>
YOU SWING FROM ONE THING TO THE NEXT LIKE A FULL BLOWN ADD SUFFERER>
I am trying to keep you focussed on one thing

Answer my very first question, DO YOU THINK SAMSON IS THE FIRST SUICIDE MATYR?

It's obvious who can't focus.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7898#msg7898
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7910#msg7910

And once again, thanks for your help. While you will continue to refuse to see the difference between Christian and Islamic martyrs, those Muslim read-only participants whose hearts are beginning to open, should have no difficulty with seeing it. Particularly through the links provided.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7911#msg7911

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #23 on: October 20, 2010, 02:28:27 PM »
Peter you are so confused by the BIBLE scholars, the media the deviants the terrorists and all those that are dtermined to break every command of GOD ALMIGHTY>
YOU SWING FROM ONE THING TO THE NEXT LIKE A FULL BLOWN ADD SUFFERER>
I am trying to keep you focussed on one thing

Answer my very first question, DO YOU THINK SAMSON IS THE FIRST SUICIDE MATYR?

It's obvious who can't focus.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7898#msg7898
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7910#msg7910

And once again, thanks for your help. While you will continue to refuse to see the difference between Christian and Islamic martyrs, those Muslim read-only participants whose hearts are beginning to open, should have no difficulty with seeing it. Particularly through the links provided.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7911#msg7911

WHY WONT YOU ANSWER A SIMPLE QUESTION? YOU LIKE TO ANSWER ISLAM?
SIMPLY ANSWER THE QUESTION HOW WOULD YOU CHARACTERIZE SAMSON IN THE JUDGE OF JUDGES SECTION OF THE BIBLE?

Mujaheed

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Re: The first Suicide Soldier
« Reply #24 on: October 20, 2010, 02:43:51 PM »
And once again, thanks for your help. While you will continue to refuse to see the difference between Christian and Islamic martyrs, those Muslim read-only participants whose hearts are beginning to open, should have no difficulty with seeing it. Particularly through the links provided.
http://www.islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg7911#msg7911
[/quote]

I have not helped you yet, the difference between me and you is that I get my information from ALLAH (Al "the" ielaah GOD) I am not in the habit of asking the media (none religious well atheist based) news readers for my definitions, A matyr is not a suicide bomber that is a political statement invented by the CIA to cause instability in the middle east" ONLY AN IGNORANT FOOL CANNOT FIND THE HISTORY OF PALESTINE and Jerusalem, ONLY AN IDIOT THINKS IRAN AND IRAQ STARTED THE WAR IN 1980, The INFIDELS G:O: D (GOLD OIL AND DOLLAR) FEARING MASSES HAS WAGED WARS AND COINED PHRASES LIKE JIHAAD AND SUICIDE BOMBERS AND EXTREMIST AND THOSE STUPID ENOUGH TO BELIEVE THEM OBVIOUSLY HAS NOT SEEN A GATHERING OF 5 MILLION MUSLIMS IN BAGLADESH (KONI) HAPPEN FOR THREE DAYS, PEACEFULLY, no frenzy, no jihaad calling no mass hysteria, lectures citing the good examples set by all the prophets of ALLAH. WAKE UP MY FRIEND AND TAKE THE SHEKELS FROM YOUR EYES> TAKE THE BEAM OUT IT IS BLINDING YOU


ISLAM CLEARLY DEFINES WHAT A MATYR IS AS IT CLEARLY DEFINES ALL OF THE LAWS AS SENT TO HUMANS>
« Last Edit: June 15, 2019, 03:56:28 AM by PeteWaldo »