MOHAMMED'S "LAW" (split off "Islam, Slavery & the Sword")

[Peter]

From this thread post on Mohammed's beheading of 800 innocent Jewish farmers - boys and men - split off as a separate subject.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1930.msg8222#msg8222

SO DID MUHAMMAD FOLLOW THE LAW OF THE BIBLE WHEN HE instituted his punishment? Yes or No

NO. He followed his flesh. That's the whole point. Your blindness to it and insistence on rejecting YHWH to follow a 7th century reprobate is what makes you a MOHAMMEDan.

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, [even] in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Do you really believe that beheading an innocent 10 year old boy and raping his 9 year old sister and mother describes love, in the Christian era?

Pretending that the 1600 year progressive revelation of God to mankind, ended at its beginning with the book of Deuteronomy, in an effort to justify Mohammed's 7th century reprobate nature, 500 years after the Scriptures were closed, thoroughly display's your abject rejection of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and your having been delivered over to the spirit of antichrist.

OH I FORGOT YOUR ARROGANCE DOES NOT ALLOW YOU TO ANSWER A QUESTION ANY WHERE IN THE THREAD.
YOUR DEVIATION, UNSCRUPULOUS LIES AND DECEIT DOES NOT ALLOW YOU TO GIVE A STRAIGHT ANSWER TO ANY QUESTION IN THIS FORUM, INSTEAD A LINK TO THE SAME LIES AND IPINIONS OVER AND OVER AGAIN

ARE YOU AFRAID TO JUDGE BY WHAT IS IN YOUR BIBLE?

DID MUHAMMAD FOLLOW THE VERSE? YES OR NO, SIMPLE AND I DONT MIND IF YOU ELABORATE.

THE WAY YOU INTERPRET EVENTS IS NOTHING BUT AN INDICATION OF YOUR IMMATURITY (OF YOUR MIND) NOT OF YOUR BODY, Your narrow minded bigotry ..........

All it requires is a conscience to judge Mohammed and his fellow rapists.

Bukhari:V5B59N459 "I entered the Mosque, saw Abu, sat beside him and asked about sex. Abu Said said, 'We went out with Allah's Apostle and we received female slaves from among the captives. We desired women and we loved to do coitus interruptus.'"

.......... and disbelief in your own bible verses ......

Mark 12:29  And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments [is], Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this [is] the first commandment.  31 And the second [is] like, [namely] this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

...... you so love to quote at your convenience is blinding you to the truth and I feel sorry for you. You are trying very hard but in the wrong direction.

The stunning ignorance you express by suffering under the preposterous delusion that you, or Mohammed, or any other Mohammedan over the last 1400 years, follow any law but Mohammed's law, along with the pagan Quraish's black stone idol and Saee jinn-demon worship "law", expresses your most ridiculous blindness. No I take that back. This thread reveals a mind incapable of even operating within the realms of common human decency. You have, however, been very useful in helping us get to see firsthand how Mohammed's mind worked, and how the spirit of antichrist works in you. I'll likely let this thread stand on it's own rather than merging it, as it offers such excellent insight into the Mohammedan mind.

Your actually believing that because Mohammed didn't eat pork, that somehow his rape, pillage, plunder and slaughter of innocents through imperialistic conquest, slavery, and subjugation of those innocents to satan's antichrist religion, is OK. For pity's sake you don't even observe the Sabbath but Mohammed's Friday instead.

"In fact, Muhammad deliberately chose Friday over the Sabbath as a way of degrading the Jews:"
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1932.msg8225#msg8225
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halakha

[Mujaheed]

SO DID MUHAMMAD FOLLOW THE LAW OF THE BIBLE WHEN HE instituted his punishment? Yes or No

NO. He followed his flesh. That's the whole point. Your blindness to it and insistence on rejecting YHWH to follow a 7th century reprobate is what makes you a MOHAMMEDan.

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, [even] in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Do you really believe that beheading an innocent 10 year old boy and raping his 9 year old sister and mother describes love, in the Christian era?

Pretending that the 1600 year progressive revelation of God to mankind, ended at its beginning with the book of Deuteronomy, in an effort to justify Mohammed's 7th century reprobate nature, 500 years after the Scriptures were closed, thoroughly display's your abject rejection of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and your having been delivered over to the spirit of antichrist.

OH I FORGOT YOUR ARROGANCE DOES NOT ALLOW YOU TO ANSWER A QUESTION ANY WHERE IN THE THREAD.
YOUR DEVIATION, UNSCRUPULOUS LIES AND DECEIT DOES NOT ALLOW YOU TO GIVE A STRAIGHT ANSWER TO ANY QUESTION IN THIS FORUM, INSTEAD A LINK TO THE SAME LIES AND IPINIONS OVER AND OVER AGAIN

ARE YOU AFRAID TO JUDGE BY WHAT IS IN YOUR BIBLE?

DID MUHAMMAD FOLLOW THE VERSE? YES OR NO, SIMPLE AND I DONT MIND IF YOU ELABORATE.

THE WAY YOU INTERPRET EVENTS IS NOTHING BUT AN INDICATION OF YOUR IMMATURITY (OF YOUR MIND) NOT OF YOUR BODY, Your narrow minded bigotry ..........

All it requires is a conscience to judge Mohammed and his fellow rapists.

Bukhari:V5B59N459 "I entered the Mosque, saw Abu, sat beside him and asked about sex. Abu Said said, 'We went out with Allah's Apostle and we received female slaves from among the captives. We desired women and we loved to do coitus interruptus.'"

.......... and disbelief in your own bible verses ......

Mark 12:29  And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments [is], Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this [is] the first commandment.  31 And the second [is] like, [namely] this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

...... you so love to quote at your convenience is blinding you to the truth and I feel sorry for you. You are trying very hard but in the wrong direction.

The stunning ignorance you express by suffering under the preposterous delusion that you, or Mohammed, or any other Mohammedan over the last 1400 years, follow any law but Mohammed's law, along with the pagan Quraish's black stone idol and Saee jinn-demon worship "law", expresses your most ridiculous blindness. No I take that back. This thread reveals a mind incapable of even operating within the realms of common human decency. You have, however, been very useful in helping us get to see firsthand how Mohammed's mind worked, and how the spirit of antichrist works in you. I'll likely let this thread stand on it's own rather than merging it, as it offers such excellent insight into the Mohammedan mind.

Your actually believing that because Mohammed didn't eat pork, that somehow his rape, pillage, plunder and slaughter of innocents through imperialistic conquest, slavery, and subjugation of those innocents to satan's antichrist religion, is OK. For pity's sake you don't even observe the Sabbath but Mohammed's Friday instead.

"In fact, Muhammad deliberately chose Friday over the Sabbath as a way of degrading the Jews:"
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1932.msg8225#msg8225
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halakha

SO JESUS CAME TO DESTROY THE LAW THAT GOD SENT? DEUTORONOMY NO LONGER APPLIES
THERE ARE NO LAWS AGAINST CRIME? AND THE LAW ENFORCER IS A CRIMINAL IF HE DOES NOT FORGIVE YOU AND LET YOU REPENT AND LOVE YOU WHEN YOU COMMIT A CRIME?

THE JEWS WERE ANYTHING BUT NEIGHBORLY, PLOTTING THE DEATH OF AN ENTIRE CITY, HOW NEIGHBORLY!!!!

AGAIN CONJECTURE REGARDING THE AGES OF THE BEHEADED AND A VILE ACCUSATION OF RAPE, BRING THE EVIDENCE OH I FORGOT YOUR WHOLE POINT AND PURPOSE IS TO PROVE THE QURAN 100% Spot on

THEY SAY A thing and it is nothing but conjecture ring a bell

THANK YOU FOR CONFIRMING THAT YOU ARE EXACTLY AS THE QURAN DESCRIBES YOU!!!!

[resistingrexmundi]

SO JESUS CAME TO DESTROY THE LAW THAT GOD SENT? DEUTORONOMY NO LONGER APPLIES
THERE ARE NO LAWS AGAINST CRIME? AND THE LAW ENFORCER IS A CRIMINAL IF HE DOES NOT FORGIVE YOU AND LET YOU REPENT AND LOVE YOU WHEN YOU COMMIT A CRIME?

Certainly not. He fulfilled it. Refocusing the Law to inward change instead of outward religious practice that has no substance. The rituals that God gave in the OT were types and shadows of a fulfillment in Jesus. Passover for instance was a foreshadowing of the crucifixion. In that hour a perfect "lamb" was sacraficed as atonement for sin. In that eternal death passes over those who accept that sacrafice.

THE JEWS WERE ANYTHING BUT NEIGHBORLY, PLOTTING THE DEATH OF AN ENTIRE CITY, HOW NEIGHBORLY!!!!

I would refrain from such broad generalizations. Just as not all muslims are the same neither are all Jews. And in concerns to the conquest of Canaan those people they fought against sacraficed children by laying them on brazen hot idols. Not the type of people God wanted intermingling with His chosen and also I would add they had centuries to repent. Now there is a better way through Jesus.

AGAIN CONJECTURE REGARDING THE AGES OF THE BEHEADED AND A VILE ACCUSATION OF RAPE, BRING THE EVIDENCE OH I FORGOT YOUR WHOLE POINT AND PURPOSE IS TO PROVE THE QURAN 100% Spot on

Your lack of empathy to answer a single question about the moral fortitude of a man that took the daughter of a tortured and slain enemy has not allowed you to see the evidence. The Qur'an clearly allows for Muhammad as well as other muslims to take their women, whether wives or concubines, in any manner they choose. Muhammad was poisoned by a woman he forced to sleep with him. If she despised him so much to attempt his assassination why then would she willingly give in to his desires. That constitutes rape. That doesn't even begin to scratch the surface when you consider Aisha who was too young to decide on her own what she desired.
THEY SAY A thing and it is nothing but conjecture ring a bell

THANK YOU FOR CONFIRMING THAT YOU ARE EXACTLY AS THE QURAN DESCRIBES YOU!!!!

You have made this claim several times and yet you still continue. If you feel so sure that the Qur'an is 100% right about Christians then why do you persist?

[Peter]

SO JESUS CAME TO DESTROY THE LAW THAT GOD SENT? DEUTORONOMY NO LONGER APPLIES

Are you suggesting that Mohammed, or you, keep the law?
Of course not, as I am sure you would agree that only a complete imbecile could suggest that Mohammedans follow the law, when they don't even keep the Sabbath!
"In fact, Muhammad deliberately chose Friday over the Sabbath as a way of degrading the Jews:"
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1932.msg8225#msg8225
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halakha
So have you stopped to consider just why it is, that the only parts of the law that you pick and choose, are those from 3500 years ago at the beginnings of God's revelation, and lessons to primitive man, in efforts to justify Mohammed's purely and thoroughly reprobate 7th century behavior, in the Christian era?

[Mujaheed]

SO JESUS CAME TO DESTROY THE LAW THAT GOD SENT? DEUTORONOMY NO LONGER APPLIES

Are you suggesting that Mohammed, or you, keep the law?
Of course not, as I am sure you would agree that only a complete imbecile could suggest that Mohammedans follow the law, when they don't even keep the Sabbath!
"In fact, Muhammad deliberately chose Friday over the Sabbath as a way of degrading the Jews:"
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1932.msg8225#msg8225
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halakha
So have you stopped to consider just why it is, that the only parts of the law that you pick and choose, are those from 3500 years ago at the beginnings of God's revelation, and lessons to primitive man, in efforts to justify Mohammed's purely and thoroughly reprobate 7th century behavior, in the Christian era?

There is no doubt that the Jews had deviated from belief and correct worship of THE GOD, Jesus testifies to this, NABI YAHYA(John the Baptist) was killed for his beliefs and preaching the correct way to worship.

So the law as the Jews had it had to be corrected and the true meaning had to be revealed to the world after further deviation by the Pagan CHRISTIAN writers of NICEAN COUNCIL,

 THE MERCY UNTO ALL MANKIND- MUHAMMAD, THE MOST LOVED BT ALLAH, RASOOL (MESSENGER TO MANKIND FROM ALLAH CAME TO SHOW HUMANITY THE TRUE WAY TO LIVE> a path that lead him through the turmoil and suffering is wrought with immense trials and tribulations and despite your best efforts to make him sound like a tyrant ruler (shows your ignorance of GOD) He achieved more than anyone before him in succeeding to get more nations to the worship THE GOD (ALLAH) of ABRAHAM, MOSES< DAWUD< EESA< YAHYA AND ALL THE PROPHETS SENT BY ALLAH.

[Peter]

THE MERCY UNTO ALL MANKIND- MUHAMMAD, THE MOST LOVED BT ALLAH, RASOOL (MESSENGER TO MANKIND FROM ALLAH CAME TO SHOW HUMANITY THE TRUE WAY TO LIVE>

That is, of course, why I previously said you reject YHWH and the Gospel to follow Mohammed's law - of the flesh. And you do it through the pagan Quraish's black stone idol, and Saee jinn-demon worship ritual.
http://www.petewaldo.com/hajj___umrah.htm#al_safa_al_marwah

That's why Christians believe that YHWH is about loving our neighbors, in the Christian era.
That's why you believe that Mohammed's "Allah" is about beheading boys and men, enslaving and raping their wives and children, and stealing their property, in the Christian era.

[Mujaheed]

THE MERCY UNTO ALL MANKIND- MUHAMMAD, THE MOST LOVED BT ALLAH, RASOOL (MESSENGER TO MANKIND FROM ALLAH CAME TO SHOW HUMANITY THE TRUE WAY TO LIVE>

That is, of course, why I previously said you reject YHWH and the Gospel to follow Mohammed's law - of the flesh. And you do it through the pagan Quraish's black stone idol, and Saee jinn-demon worship ritual.
http://www.petewaldo.com/hajj___umrah.htm#al_safa_al_marwah

That's why Christians believe that YHWH is about loving our neighbors, in the Christian era.
That's why you believe that Mohammed's "Allah" is about beheading boys and men, enslaving and raping their wives and children, and stealing their property, in the Christian era.

AS STATED BEFORE YOU ARE DELUSIONAL, NOTHING BUT A LIAR AND A CONJECTURER
AND THE ABOVE STATEMENTS PROVE MY CLAIMS AS I HAVE CORRECTED YOUR FALSE STATEMENTS SEVERAL TIMES BEFORE AND YET YOU PERSIST WITH NO EVIDENCE OR BIBLICAL VERSES OR QURANIC VERSES!!!!!

Allahu la ilaha illa Huwa, Al-Haiyul-Qaiyum La ta'khudhuhu sinatun wa la nawm, lahu ma fis-samawati wa ma fil-'ard Man dhal-ladhi yashfa'u 'indahu illa bi-idhnihi Ya'lamu ma baina aidihim wa ma khalfahum, wa la yuhituna bi shai'im-min 'ilmihi illa bima sha'a Wasi'a kursiyuhus-samawati wal ard, wa la ya'uduhu hifdhuhuma Wa Huwal 'Aliyul-Adheem

"Allah! There is no god but He - the Living, The Self-subsisting, Eternal. No slumber can seize Him Nor Sleep. His are all things In the heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede In His presence except As he permitteth? He knoweth What (appeareth to His creatures As) Before or After or Behind them. Nor shall they compass Aught of his knowledge Except as He willeth. His throne doth extend Over the heavens And on earth, and He feeleth No fatigue in guarding And preserving them, For He is the Most High. The Supreme (in glory)."
[Surah al-Baqarah 2: 255]

[Peter]

Why deny it and make accusations against me?
Why not proudly proclaim, that in the 7th century of the Christian era, your "Allah" is about.....

Bukhari:V5B59N459 I entered the Mosque, saw Abu, sat beside him and asked about sex. Abu Said said, "We went out with Allah's Apostle and we received female slaves from among the captives. We desired women and we loved to do coitus interruptus."

Doesn't that make you puff up with pride? Why not shout it from the rooftops?

[Mujaheed]

Why deny it and make accusations against me?
Why not proudly proclaim, that in the 7th century of the Christian era, your "Allah" is about.....

Bukhari:V5B59N459 I entered the Mosque, saw Abu, sat beside him and asked about sex. Abu Said said, "We went out with Allah's Apostle and we received female slaves from among the captives. We desired women and we loved to do coitus interruptus."

Doesn't that make you puff up with pride? Why not shout it from the rooftops?

In this Hadith, what is the lesson according to you? WHAT IS THE SHAME OF A STORY TOLD IN AND HONEST SINCERE MANNER to accurately depict the conditions prevailing at the time?

Why would you site one hadith over and over again out of the thousands of Hadith

Do you understand the purpose of the Hadith?

AGAIN NOTHING BUT LIES AND CONJECTURE:
LIES:IT IS AN INCOMPLETE STORY AND TOLD IN A MANNER TO MISLEAD
Conjecture: You concluded that it is something bad and sinister that did not ever take place in the BIBLE.

[Peter]

Why deny it and make accusations against me?
Why not proudly proclaim, that in the 7th century of the Christian era, your "Allah" is about.....

Bukhari:V5B59N459 I entered the Mosque, saw Abu, sat beside him and asked about sex. Abu Said said, "We went out with Allah's Apostle and we received female slaves from among the captives. We desired women and we loved to do coitus interruptus."

Doesn't that make you puff up with pride? Why not shout it from the rooftops?

In this Hadith, what is the lesson according to you? WHAT IS THE SHAME OF A STORY TOLD IN AND HONEST SINCERE MANNER to accurately depict the conditions prevailing at the time?

You mean the conditions prevailing among Mohammed's ignorant, isolated, pagan Arabian Quraish tribe, who built their kaaba in Mecca for moon, sun, star and jinn-demon worship, and whose black stone idol Muslims still bow toward 5 times a day, and travel to and circumambulate like the pagan Arabians did?

Or the conditions among the more literate but still backwards people of YHWH, who were slaughtered, raped, robbed, and exiled by Mohammed and his followers throughout Arabia?

Or do you mean the conditions prevailing in the rest of the known world that was quite advanced at the time - 6 centuries into the Christian era?
With even a mechanical computer having been built, over 700 years before Mohammed.
The Antikythera Mechanism. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antikythera_mechanism
It was 6 centuries into the Christian era, and after YHWH had revealed Himself through Jesus Christ and taught His people to....

Mark 12:31 And the second [is] like, [namely] this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, [even] in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

And so God's people even in the civilized world, were slaughtered by the Romans, and then by the Mohammedans all the way up to France and Austria. Just as His people are slaughtered by Mohammedans all around the world today. Two million killed today in the Sudan alone, and raped and pressed into sexual slavery, by the hands of Mohammedan barbarians.
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
But we are taught to expect it because Satan's people have never been able to stand the light of truth.

2 Timothy 3:12 Yea, and all that will  live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

[Peter]

There is no doubt that the Jews had deviated from belief and correct worship of THE GOD, Jesus testifies to this, NABI YAHYA(John the Baptist) was killed for his beliefs and preaching the correct way to worship.

The Apostles and many more 1st century Christians were martyred, purely for holding and proclaiming their beliefs, and "preaching the correct way to worship", just as Jesus did and was martyred for it.  (except John - but not for lack of trying!)

Scroll the bolded font titles on this page for the accounts of 1st century martyrdom.
http://www.homecomers.org/mirror/martyrs010.htm#67
YouTube details a few
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA

That's what martyrdom is.
Not getting killed inadvertently, while engaged in the act of slaughtering innocent peaceful people, through imperialistic conquest, as Mohammed's 7th century law suggests.

[Mujaheed]

There is no doubt that the Jews had deviated from belief and correct worship of THE GOD, Jesus testifies to this, NABI YAHYA(John the Baptist) was killed for his beliefs and preaching the correct way to worship.

The Apostles and many more 1st century Christians were martyred, purely for holding and proclaiming their beliefs, and "preaching the correct way to worship", just as Jesus did and was martyred for it.  (except John - but not for lack of trying!)

Scroll the bolded font titles on this page for the accounts of 1st century martyrdom.
http://www.homecomers.org/mirror/martyrs010.htm#67
YouTube details a few
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4rtYAO3UxA

That's what martyrdom is.
Not getting killed inadvertently, while engaged in the act of slaughtering innocent peaceful people, through imperialistic conquest, as Mohammed's 7th century law suggests.

That is correct the Apostles were martyred for their beliefs and by the time the bIBLE WAS COMPILED THEY WERE NO LONGER THERE TO GIVE guidance as to the correct translation and interpretation of the 300 year debate amongst the various groups that emerged to the point of finalising the what we now Know as the BIBLE.

"Lists were compiled as early as A.D. 200. The canon we have today was set forth by Athanasius, bishop of Alexandria, in his Easter letter of A.D. 367. This list was approved by church councils meeting at Hippo Regius in 393 and Carthage in 397."

Despite data culled from the New Testament and from Jewish, Greek, and Roman writings, we do not have adequate materials for a biography of Jesus. Our main source for his life is the four gospels of the New Testament, probably composed in the last quarter of the century (about fifty years after Jesus's death), when his utterances and actions, recounted by disciples and their followers, had been reformulated in light of later Christian views of his messiahship. The same historiological dilemma holds for a reconstruction of the gradual process by which Judaism and Christianity separated. As a result, our picture of the rise of the new faith must inevitably rely on a considerable amount of conjecture.

[Peter]

What is the source of your copy and paste? Just because you wish something were true, doesn't make it true.

"The last books of the New Testament were written by about 100 A.D. by the apostle John who was still alive at that time. We have over 5300 partial or complete manuscripts of the New Testament penned prior to fourth century A.D. Though not assembled into what we now know now as the New Testament until 300 A.D., those canonical writings of Jesus' apostles were being read all over the known world." (reply on that thread)
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=97.0

Regarding the martyrdom of the followers of Jesus Christ ever since the 1st century - indeed so many at the hands of Islam - and your understanding of martyrdom as elsewhere revealed, in detail.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.45

[Peter]

Following two posts moved from extension of "Could God do That" thread
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1908.0

I am not differing with the Book only where the book contradicts itself .......

Then why is your holy day on Friday instead of the Sabbath?

...... and I understand it to be scholars writing in there time for there time according to limited knowledge they had and subsequent translators interpreting the Bookaccording to their beliefs.

[Peter]

I REJECT THE BOOK (OF THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK) AS IT IS JUST A BOOK AS ANY OTHER WRITTEN FROM THE HEARTS MINDS OF MEN WITH POLITICAL AGENDAS. IT IS TRANSLATED AND DEVIATED TO THE EXTENT THAT IT IS DIFFICULT TO DISCERN BETWEEN TRUTH AND FALSEHOOD. FURTHER DISTORTED BY POPULAR OPINIONS LIKE YOURSELF>

Then why did you in the post before pretend otherwise when you said "I am not differing with the Book only where the book contradicts itself ......"?

That you reject the 1600 year record of YHWH to mankind through all of His prophets and witnesses is what I have been saying all along.
Instead you follow Mohammed (and his alter ego "Allah"). We get it.

[Mujaheed]

I REJECT THE BOOK (OF THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK) AS IT IS JUST A BOOK AS ANY OTHER WRITTEN FROM THE HEARTS MINDS OF MEN WITH POLITICAL AGENDAS. IT IS TRANSLATED AND DEVIATED TO THE EXTENT THAT IT IS DIFFICULT TO DISCERN BETWEEN TRUTH AND FALSEHOOD. FURTHER DISTORTED BY POPULAR OPINIONS LIKE YOURSELF>

Then why did you in the post before pretend otherwise when you said "I am not differing with the Book only where the book contradicts itself ......"?

That you reject the 1600 year record of YHWH to mankind through all of His prophets and witnesses is what I have been saying all along.
Instead you follow Mohammed (and his alter ego "Allah"). We get it.

THE MORE I ENGAGE WITH YOU THE MORE I AM SHOWN THE LIGHT THE MORE THE ENGLISH VERSION OF THE BIBLE LOOKS LIKE THE WORK OF SATAN,

I must tell you that I am not allowed to reject the Injeel of Jesus, and not to reject the BOOK (BIBLIOS in Greek or Book in English) of the Christians as it may contain fragments of the original words of the Prophets and as a Muslim I have to be careful not to reject those words like, Hear Ye O' ISrael your LORD THE GOD (ALLAH) is one.

I must offer my apologies as I said that "I reject the BOOK" in anger and I would not even bother with posting anything if I did. I am a human being and asking ALLAH for forgiveness is what I must do everyday, repentance opens ones heart to guidance and that leads to closeness to ALLAH, CREATOR SUSTAINER AND LORD OF THE ENTIRE CREATION>

[Peter]

I REJECT THE BOOK (OF THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK) AS IT IS JUST A BOOK AS ANY OTHER WRITTEN FROM THE HEARTS MINDS OF MEN WITH POLITICAL AGENDAS. IT IS TRANSLATED AND DEVIATED TO THE EXTENT THAT IT IS DIFFICULT TO DISCERN BETWEEN TRUTH AND FALSEHOOD. FURTHER DISTORTED BY POPULAR OPINIONS LIKE YOURSELF>

Then why did you in the post before pretend otherwise when you said "I am not differing with the Book only where the book contradicts itself ......"?

That you reject the 1600 year record of YHWH to mankind through all of His prophets and witnesses is what I have been saying all along.
Instead you follow Mohammed (and his alter ego "Allah"). We get it.

THE MORE I ENGAGE WITH YOU THE MORE I AM SHOWN THE LIGHT THE MORE THE ENGLISH VERSION OF THE BIBLE LOOKS LIKE THE WORK OF SATAN,

That's a good sign! It indicates that you are coming to understand how thoroughly Mohammed's STAND-ALONE 23 year 7th century record is revealed as the EXACT OPPOSITE of the Gospel. Seems we're making progress!
That's why I keep repeating that ONE MUST CHOOSE - between the 1600 year record of YHWH to mankind through ALL of His prophets and witnesses that His people have followed through 2 covenants for 3500 years - or Mohammed and his alter ego "Allah". http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=2029.0
Currently you choose to follow the 7th century murdering, prisoner raping, thief.
Soon maybe you will choose to follow the sinless Messiah. The only person in human history ever born of a virgin by the will of God. The Prince of Peace who taught we are to love our neighbors - not smite them at the neck.

I must tell you that I am not allowed to reject the Injeel of Jesus, and not to reject the BOOK (BIBLIOS in Greek or Book in English) of the Christians as it may contain fragments of the original words of the Prophets and as a Muslim I have to be careful not to reject those words like, Hear Ye O' ISrael your LORD THE GOD (ALLAH) is one.

I must offer my apologies as I said that "I reject the BOOK" in anger and I would not even bother with posting anything if I did.

You can't see this yet but if you can open your hard heart, you will come to realize that once you quit pretending to acknowledge the Gospel - even as you reject the whole main subject of Jesus' crucifixion, death and resurrection - all you are left with is the ranting of a single 7th century southwest Arabian desert dwelling illiterate and his alter ego "Allah", that arrived in a desperately insignificant place, 500 years too late.

1Cr 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

I am a human being and asking ALLAH for forgiveness is what I must do everyday, repentance opens ones heart to guidance and that leads to closeness to ALLAH, CREATOR SUSTAINER AND LORD OF THE ENTIRE CREATION>

2Cr 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or [if] ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with [him].

[Peter]

I am not differing with the Book only where the book contradicts itself .......

Then why is your holy day on Friday instead of the Sabbath?

More on Mohammed's law breaking.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1932.0

...... and I understand it to be scholars writing in there time for there time according to limited knowledge they had and subsequent translators interpreting the Bookaccording to their beliefs.

The fact is the ones present at the time were the ONLY ones with knowledge OF THEIR TIME.
That's what makes the 7th and 8th century created Mohammedan fictional history, that must necessarily be labeled "tradition", such preposterous nonsense.

[Peter]

I REJECT THE BOOK (OF THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK) AS IT IS JUST A BOOK AS ANY OTHER WRITTEN FROM THE HEARTS MINDS OF MEN WITH POLITICAL AGENDAS. IT IS TRANSLATED AND DEVIATED TO THE EXTENT THAT IT IS DIFFICULT TO DISCERN BETWEEN TRUTH AND FALSEHOOD. FURTHER DISTORTED BY POPULAR OPINIONS LIKE YOURSELF>

Then why did you in the post before pretend otherwise when you said "I am not differing with the Book only where the book contradicts itself ......"?

That you reject the 1600 year record of YHWH to mankind through all of His prophets and witnesses is what I have been saying all along.
Instead you follow Mohammed (and his alter ego "Allah"). We get it.

THE MORE I ENGAGE WITH YOU THE MORE I AM SHOWN THE LIGHT THE MORE THE ENGLISH VERSION OF THE BIBLE LOOKS LIKE THE WORK OF SATAN,

No versions of the Gospel, in any language, from any period throughout the Christian era, ever have, or do, contradict Jesus' sacrifice on the cross to save mankind from sin. That's what the Gospel - the Messiah and His new covenant - have always been about.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1175.0
That's what Mohammed's 7th century religion is the opposite of. Like the negative of a photograph.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=148.0

Just like you need to find evidence of Mohammed's religion, ever having existed before Mohammed, why don't you at the same time find for us a version of the New Testament, from any point in history, in any language whatsoever, that tells a different story other than Jesus sacrificed Himself on the cross, to save all mankind from sin, through faith in His shed blood?

Heaping on more blasphemy against the Word of God will never magically create thousands of years of history for Mecca.
Surely you can see how futile it is invoke Mohammed's alter ego "Allah", to stand against the 1600 year record of YHWH to mankind, if you can't even bring any evidence that suggests that Mohammed's religion ever existed before Mohammed.
You are still on probation. One thread at a time.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1912.msg8515#msg8515

I would like to thank you for your help with the new thread.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=2023.0

[Peter]

SO JESUS CAME TO DESTROY THE LAW THAT GOD SENT? DEUTORONOMY NO LONGER APPLIES

Are you suggesting that Mohammed, or you, keep the law?
Of course not, as I am sure you would agree that only a complete imbecile could suggest that Mohammedans follow the law, when they don't even keep the Sabbath!
"In fact, Muhammad deliberately chose Friday over the Sabbath as a way of degrading the Jews:"
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1932.msg8225#msg8225
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halakha
So have you stopped to consider just why it is, that the only parts of the law that you pick and choose, are those from 3500 years ago at the beginnings of God's revelation, and lessons to primitive man, in efforts to justify Mohammed's purely and thoroughly reprobate 7th century behavior, in the Christian era?

There is no doubt that the Jews had deviated from belief and correct worship of THE GOD, Jesus testifies to this, NABI YAHYA(John the Baptist) was killed for his beliefs and preaching the correct way to worship.

So the law as the Jews had it had to be corrected and the true meaning had to be revealed to the world after further deviation by the Pagan CHRISTIAN writers of NICEAN COUNCIL,  

This obviously can't be the reason you follow Mohammed and his alter ego "Allah" instead of YHWH, if for no other reason than Mohammedan claims, that the Kaaba was built by Adam - the first man on earth.
The real historical record tells the true story.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1133.0
Please don't reply to this post until you address the prior post.

[Mujaheed]

I REJECT THE BOOK (OF THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK) AS IT IS JUST A BOOK AS ANY OTHER WRITTEN FROM THE HEARTS MINDS OF MEN WITH POLITICAL AGENDAS. IT IS TRANSLATED AND DEVIATED TO THE EXTENT THAT IT IS DIFFICULT TO DISCERN BETWEEN TRUTH AND FALSEHOOD. FURTHER DISTORTED BY POPULAR OPINIONS LIKE YOURSELF>

Then why did you in the post before pretend otherwise when you said "I am not differing with the Book only where the book contradicts itself ......"?

That you reject the 1600 year record of YHWH to mankind through all of His prophets and witnesses is what I have been saying all along.
Instead you follow Mohammed (and his alter ego "Allah"). We get it.

THE MORE I ENGAGE WITH YOU THE MORE I AM SHOWN THE LIGHT THE MORE THE ENGLISH VERSION OF THE BIBLE LOOKS LIKE THE WORK OF SATAN,

No versions of the Gospel, in any language, from any period throughout the Christian era, ever have, or do, contradict Jesus' sacrifice on the cross to save mankind from sin. That's what the Gospel - the Messiah and His new covenant - have always been about.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1175.0
That's what Mohammed's 7th century religion is the opposite of. Like the negative of a photograph.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=148.0

Just like you need to find evidence of Mohammed's religion, ever having existed before Mohammed, why don't you at the same time find for us a version of the New Testament, from any point in history, in any language whatsoever, that tells a different story other than Jesus sacrificed Himself on the cross, to save all mankind from sin, through faith in His shed blood?

Heaping on more blasphemy against the Word of God will never magically create thousands of years of history for Mecca.
Surely you can see how futile it is invoke Mohammed's alter ego "Allah", to stand against the 1600 year record of YHWH to mankind, if you can't even bring any evidence that suggests that Mohammed's religion ever existed before Mohammed.
You are still on probation. One thread at a time.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1912.msg8515#msg8515

I would like to thank you for your help with the new thread.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=2023.0

You discussing two issues in one here
1 THE PROPHET MUHAMMAD (MAY ALLAH BESTOW PEACE AND BLESSINGS UPON HIM), I BELIVE (I HAVE THE FIRM CONVICTION, UNDOUBTED APPROACH, FAITH) that the QURAN comes from the Creator of the entire Universe, the words of the Quran in the order and rhyme and sequence and the stories of the Prophets makes complete the religion of all the Prophets that preceded Muhammad. I understand the Life and mission of Nabi EESA fully without blashemy against The scripture (GOD"S WORD) that the LORD YOUR GOD IS ONE.

2. I am not blaspheming against the word of GOD, but I am allowed to point out the mistakes of borne out of incorrect belief about the monotheistic GOD that is on HIS THRONE ABOVE THE HEAVENS. I understand the second coming in light of the current disbelief and false doctrines (anti-christ) against the first command Hear Ye O Israel Your Lord The GOD IS ONE. (NOT A TRIUNE GOD)

MY ACCEPTANCE OF JESUS AS THE MESSIAH IS THE SAME AS IT IS FOR MUHAMMAD THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH,IT IS FROM  THE QURAN AND THE SUNNAH, not any other record is needed, I am not looking for proof (THERE IS NO RECORD OUTSIDE THE GOSPELS OF JESUS EVER HAVING EXISTED). MANY WROTE ABOUT MUHAMMAD.

THE 1600 year record is inaccurate and wracked by contradictions and absurdities as many a critique has proven beyond doubt.

I SAY SAMSON IS A SUICIDE MARTYR YOU SAY HE IS A SELF SACRIFICE MARTYR (SELF SACRIFICE DESCRIBES EVERY MUSLIM MARTYR IN THE TIME OF MUHAMMAD)


I AM REALLY SHOCKED AT YOUR THREATS, WHY WOULD YOU SHUT DOWN A DISCUSSION? MENTAL DEFEAT, Uneasy questions, your blasphemy is by far the worst I have encountered from a person, and the rudest possible tone is used and you impose a ban on me? What arrogance, what happened to your other cheek?

[resistingrexmundi]

You discussing two issues in one here
1 THE PROPHET MUHAMMAD (MAY ALLAH BESTOW PEACE AND BLESSINGS UPON HIM), I BELIVE (I HAVE THE FIRM CONVICTION, UNDOUBTED APPROACH, FAITH) that the QURAN comes from the Creator of the entire Universe, the words of the Quran in the order and rhyme and sequence and the stories of the Prophets makes complete the religion of all the Prophets that preceded Muhammad. I understand the Life and mission of Nabi EESA fully without blashemy against The scripture (GOD"S WORD) that the LORD YOUR GOD IS ONE.

But firm conviction is not proof. To call it proof is to assume my or anyone else's firm conviction is of less value, but that again would only rely on your firm conviction.

2. I am not blaspheming against the word of GOD, but I am allowed to point out the mistakes of borne out of incorrect belief about the monotheistic GOD that is on HIS THRONE ABOVE THE HEAVENS. I understand the second coming in light of the current disbelief and false doctrines (anti-christ) against the first command Hear Ye O Israel Your Lord The GOD IS ONE. (NOT A TRIUNE GOD)

Not by Muhammad's standard you aren't. But by the standard of Jesus, whom will judge you, you are. You haven't pointed out a single mistake. All you have done is highlighted your own misconceptions of scripture. And your problem with the idea of God being complex enough to have three parts that make a whole is astounding considering every human being is at least that complex. Are you not mind, body and spirit?

MY ACCEPTANCE OF JESUS AS THE MESSIAH IS THE SAME AS IT IS FOR MUHAMMAD THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH,IT IS FROM  THE QURAN AND THE SUNNAH, not any other record is needed, I am not looking for proof (THERE IS NO RECORD OUTSIDE THE GOSPELS OF JESUS EVER HAVING EXISTED). MANY WROTE ABOUT MUHAMMAD.

That simply is not true. Only the staunchest agnostics and atheists deny that a man named Jesus, who was a teacher, left no record outside of the Gospels. Furthermore the earliest Christian writings date back to 5-10 years after His crucifixion and resurrection. Conversly the oldest surviving Qur'an is over 100 years after the time of Muhammad and the hadith along with it. You may want to reconsider going down that road again.

THE 1600 year record is inaccurate and wracked by contradictions and absurdities as many a critique has proven beyond doubt.

That is patently false. Obviously those predisposed to disbelieve it are going to attack it, but it is laughable that you would speak of absurdities in the Bible when over half of the Qur'an has been abrogated because Muhammad couldn't keep his story straight.

I SAY SAMSON IS A SUICIDE MARTYR YOU SAY HE IS A SELF SACRIFICE MARTYR (SELF SACRIFICE DESCRIBES EVERY MUSLIM MARTYR IN THE TIME OF MUHAMMAD)

Would you consider it self-sacrafice if someone were killed trying to conquer a city just because it didn't accept its' way of belief? Allow me to make it a little more clear for you. If someone attacked the town you lived in and told you the only way you or your family would be safe is if they accepted their beliefs. Then in your struggle with this person you killed him. Would you consider him a martyr? Because that is what happened to millions over the years at the spread of Islam.

I AM REALLY SHOCKED AT YOUR THREATS, WHY WOULD YOU SHUT DOWN A DISCUSSION? MENTAL DEFEAT, Uneasy questions, your blasphemy is by far the worst I have encountered from a person, and the rudest possible tone is used and you impose a ban on me? What arrogance, what happened to your other cheek?

You were warned against personal attacks as well as your continued ignoring of responses to your posts. The discussion is not closed but you must engage for it to continue. You have leveled accusation after accusation without offering a shred of proof to substantiate them. This pattern is not conducive to a meaningful discussion. That is why you have been given specific instructions until you learn manners.

[Peter]

MY ACCEPTANCE OF JESUS AS THE MESSIAH IS THE SAME AS IT IS FOR MUHAMMAD THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH,IT IS FROM  THE QURAN AND THE SUNNAH, not any other record is needed, I am not looking for proof (THERE IS NO RECORD OUTSIDE THE GOSPELS OF JESUS EVER HAVING EXISTED). MANY WROTE ABOUT MUHAMMAD.

That simply is not true. Only the staunchest agnostics and atheists deny that a man named Jesus, who was a teacher, left no record outside of the Gospels. Furthermore the earliest Christian writings date back to 5-10 years after His crucifixion and resurrection. Conversly the oldest surviving Qur'an is over 100 years after the time of Muhammad and the hadith along with it. You may want to reconsider going down that road again.

Nor is there any major sect of Judaism that does not recognize that Jesus existed.

I SAY SAMSON IS A SUICIDE MARTYR YOU SAY HE IS A SELF SACRIFICE MARTYR (SELF SACRIFICE DESCRIBES EVERY MUSLIM MARTYR IN THE TIME OF MUHAMMAD)

Would you consider it self-sacrafice if someone were killed trying to conquer a city just because it didn't accept its' way of belief? Allow me to make it a little more clear for you. If someone attacked the town you lived in and told you the only way you or your family would be safe is if they accepted their beliefs. Then in your struggle with this person you killed him. Would you consider him a martyr? Because that is what happened to millions over the years at the spread of Islam.

He condemned imperialistic Islamic conquest, at the same time as he embraced it. According to his own definition.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg8030#msg8030

[Mujaheed]

MY ACCEPTANCE OF JESUS AS THE MESSIAH IS THE SAME AS IT IS FOR MUHAMMAD THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH,IT IS FROM  THE QURAN AND THE SUNNAH, not any other record is needed, I am not looking for proof (THERE IS NO RECORD OUTSIDE THE GOSPELS OF JESUS EVER HAVING EXISTED). MANY WROTE ABOUT MUHAMMAD.

That simply is not true. Only the staunchest agnostics and atheists deny that a man named Jesus, who was a teacher, left no record outside of the Gospels. Furthermore the earliest Christian writings date back to 5-10 years after His crucifixion and resurrection. Conversly the oldest surviving Qur'an is over 100 years after the time of Muhammad and the hadith along with it. You may want to reconsider going down that road again.

I am not sure how to engage in a conversation with someone that twists and distorts everything one says, you are in such a bad habit of making everything conjecture or contrived logic when I state things clearly and plainly to you.

YOU DENYING THE BENEFIT MUSLIMS BROUGHT TO ENTIRE WORLD? ARE YOU GOING TO IGNORE THE BENEFIT TO CHRISTIANITY ITSELF FROM SPAIN TO CHINA AND AFRICA, THE IMMENSE DEVELOPMENT IN ALL THE FIELDS OF MODERN CIVILIZATION? YOU CALL IT IMPERIALISTIC CONQUESTS THE REST OF THE WORLD CALLS IT PROGRESS.

I AM SPEAKING FROM AN ISLAMIC PERSPECTIVE,(THE TRUTH OF THE PROPHETS) MARTYR IS A MUSLIM THAT IS WILLING TO GIVE HIS LIFE FOR THE SAKE OF ALLAH SO THAT THE TRUTH MAY PREVAIL, HE PREFERS PEACE OVER WAR, HE PREFERS LEARNING OVER FIGHTING  AND YOU OBVIOUSLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND ISLAM AS YOU WOULD BE SO FAR OFF THE MARK WITH YOU MEDIA BRAINWASHED THEORIES>

Nor is there any major sect of Judaism that does not recognize that Jesus existed.

I SAY SAMSON IS A SUICIDE MARTYR YOU SAY HE IS A SELF SACRIFICE MARTYR (SELF SACRIFICE DESCRIBES EVERY MUSLIM MARTYR IN THE TIME OF MUHAMMAD)

Would you consider it self-sacrafice if someone were killed trying to conquer a city just because it didn't accept its' way of belief? Allow me to make it a little more clear for you. If someone attacked the town you lived in and told you the only way you or your family would be safe is if they accepted their beliefs. Then in your struggle with this person you killed him. Would you consider him a martyr? Because that is what happened to millions over the years at the spread of Islam.

He condemned imperialistic Islamic conquest, at the same time as he embraced it. According to his own definition.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=1899.msg8030#msg8030

[resistingrexmundi]

I am not sure how to engage in a conversation with someone that twists and distorts everything one says, you are in such a bad habit of making everything conjecture or contrived logic when I state things clearly and plainly to you.

Another baseless accusation. I did not twist your words. You said there was no evidence outside the NT that Jesus existed. I showed you that you were wrong. Simple as that.

YOU DENYING THE BENEFIT MUSLIMS BROUGHT TO ENTIRE WORLD? ARE YOU GOING TO IGNORE THE BENEFIT TO CHRISTIANITY ITSELF FROM SPAIN TO CHINA AND AFRICA, THE IMMENSE DEVELOPMENT IN ALL THE FIELDS OF MODERN CIVILIZATION? YOU CALL IT IMPERIALISTIC CONQUESTS THE REST OF THE WORLD CALLS IT PROGRESS.

I most certainly do. Islam has always been good at taking from others and passing off as its' own those things it couldn't do itself. The number system so many muslims crow about is from pre-Islamic India, philosophy from Greece, architecture from Byzantium, etc. In fact it was arabic speaking Jews and Christians that made the first inroads in the medical field during Islam's "golden age". Not muslims. Islam just claimed these things for itself since those Jews and Christians were dhimmis. But let's assume that Islam created this great golden age it still doesn't excuse murder, conquest, and pillaging. Period. And if you will note from history the moment Islamic expansion declined so did its' "achievements". Why do you think Islamic countries are still struggling to keep up today. They possess all that oil and all the capital necessary to lead the world in technological achievements and yet they contribute next to nothing to any field of science today.

I AM SPEAKING FROM AN ISLAMIC PERSPECTIVE,(THE TRUTH OF THE PROPHETS) MARTYR IS A MUSLIM THAT IS WILLING TO GIVE HIS LIFE FOR THE SAKE OF ALLAH SO THAT THE TRUTH MAY PREVAIL, HE PREFERS PEACE OVER WAR, HE PREFERS LEARNING OVER FIGHTING  AND YOU OBVIOUSLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND ISLAM AS YOU WOULD BE SO FAR OFF THE MARK WITH YOU MEDIA BRAINWASHED THEORIES>

You are sidestepping the question. If someone dies trying to push his way of life on another then he is not a martyr, just stupid and evil. Their is a difference in dying for what you believe in and killing and being killed for it. So answer the question once and for all or this discussion will stalemate.

"...Would you consider it self-sacrafice if someone were killed trying to conquer a city just because it didn't accept its' way of belief? Allow me to make it a little more clear for you. If someone attacked the town you lived in and told you the only way you or your family would be safe is if they accepted their beliefs. Then in your struggle with this person you killed him. Would you consider him a martyr? "


Also please learn to quote properly. Fixing these is growing taxing.