Islamic Jihad, hate & Sin - Split off of the UNFORGIVABLE SIN of "shirk" thread

[Bistabuster]

Ex and Pete are dead on.  Muj cannot answer these questions you give him. 


I think he (Muj) either doesn't understand his own Quran or that he truly does understand it yet refuses to tell us that what we are saying is right on.  Option 2 is Muj playing the deception game which is what I see that he is attempting to do.  This fella is so brainwashed in this cult, the ONLY way for Muj to see the truth is to face Jesus Christ face to face.  The only way that will occur (much to my dismay) is for Muj to die, meet Jesus and proceed directly to hell to be with his loved one (Muhammad) which is exactly where Muhammad is right now.

There is a great possibility that it is already too late for Muj.  The Bible is very clear on this point that pertains to Muj directly but it doesn't mean I'll stop praying for him.  Here's that verse.

Rev 17:17  For God hath put in their hearts to fulfill his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled. 

I promise you this.  Muhammad is praying to you (Muj) right now to accept Jesus in your life.  Muhammad already made that dire mistake and he will forever pay dearly for that mistake and I know for a FACT that ALL the inhabitants in hell are praying for people like you and me not to go where they are.  Hell scares me more than anything else.  I'll do whatever it takes not to go there. 

So, how about you?

So, Muj.  Tell me honestly.  Do you really want to go to hell?  There was a great statement a good friend of mine said.  If you were believing a lie within your own doctrine, would you want to know about it or would you just ignore it because it is outside your comfort zone or something like that.  I would like to know a lie for I personally had to change my viewpoint three times because I was misled as to what certain pieces of Scripture was saying.

[Mujaheed]

Ex and Pete are dead on.  Muj cannot answer these questions you give him. 


I think he (Muj) either doesn't understand his own Quran or that he truly does understand it yet refuses to tell us that what we are saying is right on.  Option 2 is Muj playing the deception game which is what I see that he is attempting to do.  This fella is so brainwashed in this cult, the ONLY way for Muj to see the truth is to face Jesus Christ face to face.  The only way that will occur (much to my dismay) is for Muj to die, meet Jesus and proceed directly to hell to be with his loved one (Muhammad) which is exactly where Muhammad is right now.

There is a great possibility that it is already too late for Muj.  The Bible is very clear on this point that pertains to Muj directly but it doesn't mean I'll stop praying for him.  Here's that verse.

Rev 17:17  For God hath put in their hearts to fulfill his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled. 

I promise you this.  Muhammad is praying to you (Muj) right now to accept Jesus in your life.  Muhammad already made that dire mistake and he will forever pay dearly for that mistake and I know for a FACT that ALL the inhabitants in hell are praying for people like you and me not to go where they are.  Hell scares me more than anything else.  I'll do whatever it takes not to go there. 

So, how about you?

So, Muj.  Tell me honestly.  Do you really want to go to hell?  There was a great statement a good friend of mine said.  If you were believing a lie within your own doctrine, would you want to know about it or would you just ignore it because it is outside your comfort zone or something like that.  I would like to know a lie for I personally had to change my viewpoint three times because I was misled as to what certain pieces of Scripture was saying.

My dear sir. Patronizing me is cheap shot. It doe not become you as you very bad at.

I am here because in my experience no Christian takes the time and trouble to find God.
They prefer to regurgitate the popular rhetoric and propaganda of the populace they assume to be in favor with the world view.

Most Christians are duped chastised  charmed or scared into believing what they. And over time has produced the most public declarations of atheists.

Most Christians have not read scripture objectively or took the time and trouble to question what they have been presented with. Blind faith of sheep leading sheep. 

I have had the good fortune of having had ver good fathers of the St Paul's church kindly educating me in all subjects from English my first language to math and yes the scripture. Mass and evangelism and holy communion was a subject I was tested on in examinations.

My rejection of opinion and conjecture in favor of truth is a matter or simply seeking The Lord God's guidance by making the effort to find the truth by piecing together history from phd scholars all over the world.

I have kept my arguments thus far very heartfelt but I am now going to try the spiritually academic approach.

[Bistabuster]

My dear sir. Patronizing me is cheap shot. It doe not become you as you very bad at.

Aren't you doing the same to us?  Of coarse you are.  I now know for a FACT that you are taqyiaaing us.  If that is not true, then you know NOTHING about Islam.  Not one thing.  It is a pure unadulterated FACT that Muhammad killed people for no good logical reason.  There are hundreds of examples of this that you refuse to acknowledge or refuse to believe.

I could (and will, not that Muhammad is a killing machine) show you all the relevant statements that dictate Muhammad was a killer but you can't be honest with us and say that we're right because that would degrade your one and only prophet.  You know we're right but you refuse to say so, so the only recourse you have to fall back on is the "woe is me" attitude!  There is NO WAY that you can defend this truth so you're only option is to get defensive and attack us for specifying the truth that is written in your very own sources that you know is there but are taught NOT to speak about to the non believers.  You know Muhammad was a killer.  I also know you're OK with that too.  If you were not, then you wouldn't be calling yourself a Muslim!

[Mujaheed]

My dear sir. Patronizing me is cheap shot. It doe not become you as you very bad at.

Aren't you doing the same to us?  Of coarse you are.  I now know for a FACT that you are taqyiaaing us.  If that is not true, then you know NOTHING about Islam.  Not one thing.  It is a pure unadulterated FACT that Muhammad killed people for no good logical reason.  There are hundreds of examples of this that you refuse to acknowledge or refuse to believe.

I could (and will, not that Muhammad is a killing machine) show you all the relevant statements that dictate Muhammad was a killer but you can't be honest with us and say that we're right because that would degrade your one and only prophet.  You know we're right but you refuse to say so, so the only recourse you have to fall back on is the "woe is me" attitude!  There is NO WAY that you can defend this truth so you're only option is to get defensive and attack us for specifying the truth that is written in your very own sources that you know is there but are taught NOT to speak about to the non believers.  You know Muhammad was a killer.  I also know you're OK with that too.  If you were not, then you wouldn't be calling yourself a Muslim!

No I am not doing it to you, I am not ambiguous about my statements, I am not vague about the source of my beliefs, I am not hiding, and I have never practiced Tagiyaa. AGAIN your language and accusations are the result of the conditioning of your heart. You have become accustomed to falsely accusing people (like the media) You arrogantly believe that you could know more about a subject I have been taught, I studied, I researched and questioned (from the the first word to the last) to gain knowledge of GOD. What I know is a fraction of what is available in Makkah and Madina.

MUhammad is not my one and only prophet, Muahammad peace be upon him is the only Prophet of God that gives honor and has been able to clarify the role of each prophet, Muhammad is the only Prophet that has consolidated the beliefs of all the Prophets by fulfilling the law of the all the prophets that came before. The beliefs and laws were destroyed by the the time the Council of Nicean was formed. The great debate on the Divinity of Jesus in 325. The right bishops were chosen to vote on it. Up until that point followers of Jesus did not believe that Jesus was the literal son of God. The GREEKS AND ROMANS (whose objective was to rule over the Holy land) deliberately invented a lie that they could present as an  authoritative doctrine to impress the populace with their genius (stupid) conjecture. They competed with philosophy to gain power and control.

ALL THAT OPPOSE THEM WERE KILLED!!!!! (DONT FORGET THEY SENT OUT BOUNTY HUNTERS TO KILL THE FOLLOWERS (SAUL WAS ONE OF THE MOST FAMOUS) and the turning point for them.

I am here to correct your blasphemy and deviated statement that you HAVE BEEN TAUGHT. YOUR SOURCE IS ONE (THE FAILED ROMAN AND GREEK EMPIRES THAT ARE STILL FAILING TO THIS DAY) THEY HAVE THE WORST ECONOMIES IN THE WORLD, BANKRUPT AND CORRUPT.) They have dictated to you in order to maintain the failed pride of Europeans. Its a colonial trait.

You not a Christian because you researched Jesus, you not a christian because you studied the religion of God, you a christian because you follow what was written by unknown Authors, who made ambiguous statements that were further deviated by arrogant interpretation and conjecture.
It is like contaminating pure water with bacteria only visible under a microscope.

Take a close look at who is indoctrinated by whom. More than 90% of so called Christian nations are professing to follow Jesus but the reality is they believe in the American dream of accumulation of wealth by any means necessary. In other words  they are part of a socialist (police State) wrapped in a hooded robe of capitalism (thievery and exploitation) that is set in motion by the Greek and the Romans.

[Bistabuster]

Let's see now.  What did Muhammad say?  These are the words of Muhammad unless you can prove to me somebody actually heard Allah speak to Muhammad which there is no evidence of. Don't forget to read the last paragraph!!!
 

Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".  Hate verse

Quran (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward." Kill the enemy of Allah verse

 Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."  Death and destruction to non believers verse.

Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-"  This is YOUR commandment from your ever loving prophet Muhammad.  This is HIS order to YOU!!!  Are you going to tell me you WILL NOT do this?  If I were a Muslim, I would seek you out and BEHEAD YOU until you're dead, dead, dead!  That's what I would do if I were a Muslim and that is your order AS a Muslim!

 Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"  This one is special.  Why?  You quote the verse just before this one (Sura 5:32) and call Islam peaceful.  What you don't tell us is what the next verse says which is quoted just above.  Kill the people who won't follow Muhammad since Allah really doesn't exist in the first place.  Here is Sura 5:32.  On that account: We ordained for the Children of Israel that if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people. Then although there came to them Our apostles with clear signs, yet, even after that, many of them continued to commit excesses in the land.  Here is a web page showing evidence of how you Muslims take you own Quran out of context.  http://www.emuslim.com/islamagainstVoilence.asp

Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"  Very evil verse. 

Quran (9:5) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captive and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them." So, once their little treaty was completed, Muhammad and his evil followers did this and it is still valid practice today.  Maybe you need to join the Muslim Brotherhood.  If you were to talk to them, this is what they do in the name of Islam.  Like it or not, this is Muhammad's commandment!  Follow it or true Muslims will kill you!!!  If you hate killing people, then don't be a Muslim anymore!  If you don't mind killing people, read on!

 Quran (9:14) - "Fight them, Allah will punish them by your hands and bring them to disgrace..."  Are you seriously wanting to worship THIS god???  This god wants YOU to do the killing for him.  I find the Quran very simple to read.  It gets right to the point.  No mincing words.  This god, who created ME as something else other than a Muslim wants me dead, dead, dead!  Now, why would your loving Allah do such an evil act?  Tell me.  Would you kill your children? 

Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued." We Christians and Jews ARE the people of the book, (also known as the Bible) you are ORDERED to kill!  No exceptions!!  Once again, these are the words of your wonderful prophet, Muhammad!

Quran (9:73) - "O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the hypocrites and be unyielding to them; and their abode is hell, and evil is the destination." Muslims want nothing more than to degrade ANYBODY who is NOT Muslim.  What do the true Christians want to do to Muslims?  Lead them to salvation.  Show them that the real God is not a hateful god.  Your god, Allah, is a hateful god.  Your Quran is so simple to read and understand.  No complications understanding the meaning of of it.  The only difficulty I had was understanding Arabic translations of words.  Once I understood that, it's all very simple!

 Quran (9:111) - "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Quran: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme." Pretty much self explanatory.  Go kill the infedels!  Pretty basic instructions, if you ask me!  To fight throughout all these verses so far are referring to death to the infedel! 

So, what do we do with you If you decide at this point, that this book called the Quran is a lie?  Well, have I got a surprise for you right out of the Quran that instructs me just how to deal with this very circumstance.  It is clear quite clear that under Islamic Law an apostate must be put to death. There is no dispute on this ruling among classical Muslim or modern scholars... Sura II.217 is interpreted by no less an authority than al-Shafi'i(died 820 C.E.), the founder of one of the four orthodox schools of law of Sunni Islam to mean that the death penalty should be prescribed for apostates. Sura II.217 reads: "... But whoever of you recants and dies an unbeliever , his works shall come to nothing in this world and the next, and they are the companions of the fire for ever." Al-Thalabi and al -Khazan concur. Al-Razi in his commentary on II:217 says the apostate should be killed . Similarly, IV. 89: "They would have you disbelieve as they themselves have disbelieved, so that you may be all like alike. Do not befriend them until they have fled their homes for the cause of God. If they desert you seize them and put them to death wherever you find them. Look for neither friends nor helpers among them..." Baydawi (died c. 1315-16), in his celebrated commentary on the Koran, interprets this passage to mean: "Whosover turns back from his belief ( irtada ), openly or secretly, take him and kill him wheresoever ye find him, like any other infidel. Separate yourself from him altogether .Do not accept intercession in his regard". Ibn Kathir in his commentary on this passage quoting Al Suddi (died 745) says that since the unbelievers had manifested their unbelief they should be killed.

Man, do I want to be a Muslim.  I will have so much killing to do!  Yeah........Right!

Back to killing verses!

 Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."  I truly see this in you Muj.


Quran (17:16) - "And when We wish to destroy a town, We send Our commandment to the people of it who lead easy lives, but they transgress therein; thus the word proves true against it, so We destroy it with utter destruction."  Note that the crime is moral transgression, and the punishment is "utter destruction."  (Before ordering the 9/11 attacks, Osama bin Laden first issued Americans an invitation to Islam). 

Just a little in-house cleanup!
Quran (18:65-81) - This parable lays the theological groundwork for honor killings, in which a family member is murdered because they brought shame to the family, either through apostasy or perceived moral indiscretion.  The story (which is not found in any Jewish or Christian source) tells of Moses encountering a man with "special knowledge" who does things which don't seem to make sense on the surface, but are then justified according to later explanation.  One such action is to murder a youth for no apparent reason (74).  However, the wise man later explains that it was feared that the boy would "grieve" his parents by "disobedience and ingratitude."  He was killed so that Allah could provide them a 'better' son.  (Note: This is one reason why honor killing is sanctioned by Sharia.  Reliance of the Traveler (Umdat al-Saliq) says that punishment for murder is not applicable when a parent or grandparent kills their offspring (o.1.1-2).)

Quran (33:60-62) - "If the hypocrites, and those in whose hearts is a disease, and the alarmists in the city do not cease, We verily shall urge thee on against them, then they will be your neighbors in it but a little while.  Accursed, they will be seized wherever found and slain with a (fierce) slaughter."   This passage sanctions the slaughter (rendered "merciless" and "horrible murder" in other translations) against three groups: Hypocrites (Muslims who refuse to "fight in the way of Allah" (3:167) and hence don't act as Muslims should), those with "diseased hearts" (which include Jews and Christians 5:51-52), and "alarmists" or "agitators who include those who merely speak out against Islam, according to Muhammad's biographers.  It is worth noting that the victims are to be sought out by Muslims, which is what today's terrorists do.  If this passage is meant merely to apply to the city of Medina, then it is unclear why it is included in Allah's eternal word to Muslim generations.


So, how many more hateful killing verses are there in this "so called" peace loving religion?  How about 123 verses in all.

 Quran (47:3-4) - "Those who reject Allah follow vanities, while those who believe follow the truth from their lord.  Thus does Allah set forth form men their lessons by similitude.  Therefore when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them, then make (them) prisoners,"  Those who reject Allah are to be subdued in battle.  The verse goes on to say the only reason Allah doesn't do the dirty work himself is in order to to test the faithfulness of Muslims.  Those who kill pass the test. "But if it had been Allah's Will, He could certainly have exacted retribution from them (Himself); but (He lets you fight) in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the Way of Allah,- He will never let their deeds be lost." So, if you truly want to please Allah, KILL THE INFEDELS!!!!!!

Quran (47:35) - "Be not weary and faint-hearted, crying for peace, when ye should be uppermost (Shakir: "have the upper hand") for Allah is with you,"  So, you're better than us Christians and Jews?  well, OK then!

Quran (48:29) - "Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard (ruthless) against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves"  Islam is not about treating everyone equally.  There are two very distinct standards that are applied based on religious status.  Also the word used for 'hard' or 'ruthless' in this verse shares the same root as the word translated as 'painful' or severe' in verse 16.

 Quran (61:4) - "Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way"  Religion of Peace, indeed! The verse explicitly refers to "battle array" meaning that it is speaking of physical conflict.  This is followed by (61:9): "He it is who has sent His Messenger (Mohammed) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam) to make it victorious over all religions even though the infidels may resist."  (See next verse, below).  Infidels who resist Islamic rule are to be fought.

 

Quran (61:10-12) - "O You who believe! Shall I guide you to a commerce that will save you from a painful torment. That you believe in Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad ), and that you strive hard and fight in the Cause of Allah with your wealth and your lives, that will be better for you, if you but know! (If you do so) He will forgive you your sins, and admit you into Gardens under which rivers flow, and pleasant dwelling in Gardens of 'Adn - Eternity ['Adn (Edn) Paradise], that is indeed the great success."  This verse refers to physical battle in order to make Islam victorious over other religions (see above).  It uses the Arabic word, Jihad.

Quran (66:9) - "O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey's end."  The root word of "Jihad" is used again here.  The context is clearly holy war, and the scope of violence is broadened to include "hypocrites" - those who call themselves Muslims but do not act as such.  Is this you, Muj?

Some references in the Hadith and other books of Islam.



Bukhari (52:177) - Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him." This is my favorite one.  A Muslim acquaintace I know smiled deeply about this one.  Man oh man was he looking forward to this!  This man was just following his scriptures.  You know, you too should be looking forward to this.  Me, as a Christian, am not looking forward to the day you die and will be living in hell for the rest of your life.  I know, without a shadow of ANY doubt, that you ARE heading to hell with the path you're walking down.  There is no question in my mind that will happen.  Sounds to me that's what you want to do.  Really?  You seriously want to go there?  Change your path and it won't happen to you.  That is unless you love to see the mass destruction of the Jews!

Bukhari (52:65) - The Prophet said, 'He who fights that Allah's Word, Islam, should be superior, fights in Allah's Cause.  Muhammad's words are the basis for offensive Jihad - spreading Islam by force.  This is how it was understood by his companions, and by the terrorists of today.   

Bukhari (52:220) - Allah's Apostle said... 'I have been made victorious with terror'  You're peaceful prophet said that?  So, does Muhammad say Islam is peaceful?  I think not!!  Since you said Muhammad didn't terrorize and kill anyone, you're sadly mistaken!  These are words from you're OWN BOOKS!!  You can't make this stuff up!  It is thoroughly documented!

Abu Dawud (14:2526) - The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Three things are the roots of faith: to refrain from (killing) a person who utters, "There is no god but Allah" and not to declare him unbeliever whatever sin he commits, and not to excommunicate him from Islam for his any action; and jihad will be performed continuously since the day Allah sent me as a prophet until the day the last member of my community will fight with the Dajjal (Antichrist)  Pretty much from the time Muhammad said it to the end of time, so this applies for today as well.  Kill all who are NOT Muslim!  Savage animal Muhammad was!  And you want to use him as an example as to how you should live your life?  Really?

Muslim (1:33) - the Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah.  Oh, I see.  Muhammad is special?  What about Abraham, Moses, Issiah, Jacob, Daniel, David and all the rest?  Why not say this instead.  I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that the prophets are the messengers of Allah.  That's because Muhammad wanted to be worshiped!  As I stated from the beginning.  There is no such thing as Allah.  Muhammad used that pagan god to further Muhammad's cause.

Bukhari (11:626) - [Muhammad said:] "I decided to order a man to lead the prayer and then take a flame to burn all those, who had not left their houses for the prayer, burning them alive inside their homes."  This still happens even today.  What an EVIL MAN this Muhammad is!  Are you sure you want to follow him?  I certainly don't want NOTHING to do with him.

Muslim (20:4696) - "the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: 'One who died but did not fight in the way of Allah nor did he express any desire (or determination) for Jihad died the death of a hypocrite.'"  No paradise for these people and if you WILL NOT do what Muhammad says, no paradise for you either!

Muslim (19:4294) - "When the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) appointed anyone as leader of an army or detachment he would especially exhort him... He would say: Fight in the name of Allah and in the way of Allah. Fight against those who disbelieve in Allah. Make a holy war...  When you meet your enemies who are polytheists, invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withhold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them... If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them."  So, if you don't become a Christian like I tell you to do or to pay me protection money (bribe), I can kill you, right?  That's what Muhammad taught.  There it is written in your own book.  Did you just skip over that part because it didn't apply to you?

 Bukhari 1:35  "The person who participates in (Holy Battles) in Allah’s cause and nothing compels him do so except belief in Allah and His Apostle, will be recompensed by Allah either with a reward, or booty ( if he survives) or will be admitted to Paradise ( if he is killed)."  According to Islam, this is the ONLY guaranty to get into paradise.  So, when do you want to kill me?

 Tabari 7:97  The morning after the murder of Ashraf, the Prophet declared, "Kill any Jew who falls under your power."  Ashraf was a poet, killed by Muhammad's men because he insulted Islam.  Here, Muhammad widens the scope of his orders to kill.  An innocent Jewish businessman was then slain by his Muslim partner, merely for being non-Muslim.

Tabari 9:69  "Killing Unbelievers is a small matter to us"  The words of Muhammad, prophet of Islam.  Oh, I see.  We're nobody's to you Muslims.  Words of Muhammad here.  After all, Muhammad knows best, right?  Better than Allah and especially Jesus?

Tabari 17:187  "'By God, our religion (din) from which we have departed is better and more correct than that which these people follow. Their religion does not stop them from shedding blood, terrifying the roads, and seizing properties.' And they returned to their former religion."  The words of a group of Christians who had converted to Islam, but realized their error after being shocked by the violence and looting committed in the name of Allah.  The price of their decision to return to a religion of peace was that the men were beheaded and the woman and children enslaved by the caliph Ali. One simple mistake after being lied to cost them their lives.  All the more reason NOT to become a Muslim.  If I change my mind, I die!

Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 327: - “Allah said, ‘A prophet must slaughter before collecting captives. A slaughtered enemy is driven from the land. Muhammad, you craved the desires of this world, its goods and the ransom captives would bring. But Allah desires killing them to manifest the religion.’”  More of the same hatred.

Saifur Rahman, The Sealed Nectar p.227-228 - "Embrace Islam... If you two accept Islam, you will remain in command of your country; but if your refuse my Call, you’ve got to remember that all of your possessions are perishable. My horsemen will appropriate your land, and my Prophethood will assume preponderance over your kingship."  One of several letters from Muhammad to rulers of other countries.  The significance is that the recipients were not making war or threatening Muslims.  Their subsequent defeat and subjugation by Muhammad's armies was justified merely on the basis of their unbelief.

Other than the fact that Muslims haven't killed every non-Muslim under their domain, there is very little else that they can point to as proof that theirs is a peaceful, tolerant religion.  Where Islam is dominant (as in the Middle East and Pakistan) religious minorities suffer brutal persecution with little resistance.  Where Islam is in the minority (as in Thailand, the Philippines and Europe) there is the threat of violence if Muslim demands are not met.  Either situation seems to provide a justification for religious terrorism, which is persistent and endemic to Islamic fundamentalism.

 

The reasons are obvious and begin with the Quran.  Few verses of Islam's most sacred text can be construed to fit the contemporary virtues of religious tolerance and universal brotherhood.  Those that do are earlier "Meccan" verses which are obviously abrogated by later ones.  This is why Muslim apologists speak of the "risks" of trying to interpret the Quran without their "assistance" - even while claiming that it is a perfect book.

 

Far from being mere history or theological construct, the violent verses of the Quran have played a key role in very real massacre and genocide.  This includes the brutal slaughter of tens of millions of Hindus for five centuries beginning around 1000 AD with Mahmud of Ghazni's bloody conquest.  Both he and the later Tamerlane (Islam's Genghis Khan) slaughtered an untold number merely for defending their temples from destruction.  Buddhism was very nearly wiped off the Indian subcontinent.  Judaism and Christianity met the same fate (albeit more slowly) in areas conquered by Muslim armies, including the Middle East, North Africa and parts of Europe, including today's Turkey.  Zoroastrianism, the ancient religion of a proud Persian people is despised by Muslims and barely survives in modern Iran.

 

So ingrained is violence in the religion that Islam has never really stopped being at war, either with other religions or with itself.

 

Muhammad was a military leader, laying siege to towns, massacring the men, raping their women, enslaving their children, and taking the property of others as his own.  On several occasions he rejected offers of surrender from the besieged inhabitants and even butchered captives.  He actually inspired his followers to battle when they did not feel it was right to fight, promising them slaves and booty if they did and threatening them with Hell if they did not.  Muhammad allowed his men to rape traumatized women captured in battle, usually on the very day their husbands and family members were slaughtered.

 

It is important to emphasize that, for the most part, Muslim armies waged aggressive campaigns, and the religion's most dramatic military conquests were made by the actual companions of Muhammad in the decades following his death.  The early Islamic principle of warfare was that the civilian population of a town was to be destroyed (ie. men executed, women and children taken as slaves) if they defended themselves.  Although modern apologists often claim that Muslims are only supposed to attack in self-defense, this is an oxymoron that is flatly contradicted by the accounts of Islamic historians and others that go back to the time of Muhammad.

 

Consider the example of the Qurayza Jews, who were completely obliterated only five years after Muhammad arrived in Medina.  Their leader opted to stay neutral when their town was besieged by a Meccan army that  was sent to take revenge for Muhammad's deadly caravan raids.  The tribe killed no one from either side and even surrendered peacefully to Muhammad after the Meccans had been turned back.  Yet the prophet of Islam had every male member of the Qurayza beheaded, and every woman and child enslaved, even raping one of the captives himself (what Muslim apologists might refer to as "same day marriage").

 

One of Islam's most revered modern scholars, Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi, openly sanctions offensive Jihad: "In the Jihad which you are seeking, you look for the enemy and invade him. This type of Jihad takes place only when the Islamic state is invading other [countries] in order to spread the word of Islam and to remove obstacles standing in its way."  Elsewhere, he notes: "Islam has the right to take the initiative…this is God’s religion and it is for the whole world. It has the right to destroy all obstacles in the form of institutions and traditions … it attacks institutions and traditions to release human beings from their poisonous influences, which distort human nature and curtail human freedom. Those who say that Islamic Jihad was merely for the defense of the 'homeland of Islam' diminish the greatness of the Islamic way of life."

 

The widely respected Dictionary of Islam defines Jihad as "A religious war with those who are unbelievers in the mission of Muhammad. It is an incumbent religious duty, established in the Qur'an and in the Traditions as a divine institution, and enjoined specially for the purpose of advancing Islam and of repelling evil from Muslims…[Quoting from the Hanafi school, Hedaya, 2:140, 141.], "The destruction of the sword is incurred by infidels, although they be not the first aggressors, as appears from various passages in the traditions which are generally received to this effect."
 

Muhammad's failure to leave a clear line of succession resulted in perpetual internal war following his death.  Those who knew him best first fought to keep remote tribes from leaving Islam and reverting to their preferred religion (the Ridda or 'Apostasy wars').  Then, within the closer community, early Meccan converts battled later ones.  Hostility developed between those immigrants who had traveled with Muhammad to Mecca and the Ansar at Medina who had helped them settle in.  Finally there was a violent struggle within Muhammad's own family between his favorite wife and favorite daughter - a jagged schism that has left Shias and Sunnis at each others' throats to this day.

 

The strangest and most untrue thing that can be said about Islam is that it is a Religion of Peace.  If every standard by which the West is judged and condemned (slavery, imperialism, intolerance, misogyny, sexual repression, warfare...) were applied equally to Islam, the verdict would be devastating.  Islam never gives up what it conquers, be it religion, culture, language or life.  Neither does it make apologies or any real effort at moral progress.  It is the least open to dialogue and the most self-absorbed.  It is convinced of its own perfection, yet brutally shuns self-examination and represses criticism.

 

This is what makes the Quran's verses of violence so dangerous.  They are given the weight of divine command.  While Muslim terrorists take them as literally as anything else in their holy book, and understand that Islam is incomplete without Jihad, moderates offer little to contradict them - outside of opinion.  Indeed, what do they have?  Speaking of peace and love may win over the ignorant, but when every twelfth verse of Islam's holiest book either speaks to Allah's hatred for non-Muslims or calls for their death, forced conversion, or subjugation, it's little wonder that sympathy for terrorism runs as deeply as it does in the broader community - even if most Muslims personally prefer not to interpret their religion in this way.

 

Although scholars like Ibn Khaldun, one of Islam's most respected philosophers, understood that "the holy war is a religious duty, because of the universalism of the Muslim mission and (the obligation to) convert everybody to Islam either by persuasion or by force", many other Muslims are either unaware or willfully ignorant of the Quran's near absence of verses that preach universal non-violence.  Their understanding of Islam comes from what they are taught by others.  In the West, it is typical for believers to think that their religion must be like Christianity - preaching the New Testament virtues of peace, love, and tolerance - because Muslims are taught that Islam is supposed to be superior in every way.  They are somewhat surprised and embarrassed to learn that the evidence of the Quran and the bloody history of Islam are very much in contradiction to this.

 

Others simply accept the violence.  In 1991, a Palestinian couple in America was convicted of stabbing their daughter to death for being too Westernized.  A family friend came to their defense, excoriating the jury for not understanding the "culture", claiming that the father was merely following "the religion" and saying that the couple had to "discipline their daughter or lose respect." (source).  In 2011, unrepentant Palestinian terrorists, responsible for the brutal murders of civilians, women and children explicitly in the name of Allah were treated to a luxurious "holy pilgrimage" to Mecca by the Saudi king - without a single Muslim voice raised in protest.

 

For their part, Western liberals would do well not to sacrifice critical thinking to the god of political correctness, or look for reasons to bring other religion down to the level of Islam merely to avoid the existential truth that this it is both different and dangerous.

 

There are just too many Muslims who take the Quran literally... and too many others who couldn't care less about the violence done in the name of Islam.


That's the message of Allah or have you not grasped that concept yet?  Do you just simply ignore these verses or are you lying in wait to use these verses against us because that's what you want to do?  If these verses displease you, THEN LEAVE ISLAM!!!!  Islam is not for you.  If you choose to stay Muslim, then YOU ARE A KILLER!!!  Why?  Because, if you honestly believed that Islam was indeed peaceful and these verses disturb you deeply, you would leave.  This is EXACTLY why I choose NOT to become a Muslim.  If I enjoyed killing people, then no problem.  I found the religion that fits my needs.  That, right there, makes you a killer.  This is Islam! 

[Mujaheed]

Let's see now.  What did Muhammad say?  These are the words of Muhammad unless you can prove to me somebody actually heard Allah speak to Muhammad which there is no evidence of. Don't forget to read the last paragraph!!!
 

Quran (3:151) - "Soon shall We cast terror into the hearts of the Unbelievers, for that they joined companions with Allah, for which He had sent no authority".  Hate verse

Quran (4:74) - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward." Kill the enemy of Allah verse

The verse Quran (3:151) is proof of of the authenticity of the Quran, if you read history disbelievers (infidels and ignorant people) not the the Jews and Christians that enjoyed Islamic protection to this day in Islamic countries even in Iran (google jews in IRAN. WE (ALLH and the Malaaikah) cast terror in their hearts. Like criminals fearing to be caught. I don't know what your IQ is but your misinterpretation suggest that your grasp of simple phrases seem to be questionable.

OR

Your deliberate misinterpretation is an indication of the terror in your heart or perhaps the ignorance in your brain or both?

Quran (4:74) That is not what it says, It says that one must strive The word used is strive with your health and your wealth in the way of ALLAH, IT DOES NOT SAY KILL, HE COULD BE PROTECTING HIS FAMILY FROM CHRISTIAN CRUSADES OR INVADING ZIONIST OR A WAR MONGERING DISBELIEVER.

IT DOES NOT SAY KILL THE ENEMY OF ALLAH

Again are you an unsophisticated buffoon, is the concept of war foreign to you>? Are you a buddhist or are you from a nation that invades other countries and kill people to the degree that no other muslim country ever has?

ARE YOU FROM A COUNTRY THAT HAS DROPPED NUCLEAR BOMBS ON INNOCENT CIVILLIANS AND NOW YOUR UNDERSTANDING OF A LINE LIKE THAT IS KILL THE THE EBEMY LIKE A GANGSTER??

Please Remove your sinister motives from a lll the verses that you quoted. Not a single verse is prejudiced, or without wisdom or subject to Christian misinterpretation.

How can understand the words of GOD (ALLAH) when you break the first  command??? THE LORD YOUR GOD IS UNIQUE> (ONE).

 Quran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks."  Death and destruction to non believers verse.

Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of Allah with their goods and their persons. Allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath Allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath He distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-"  This is YOUR commandment from your ever loving prophet Muhammad.  This is HIS order to YOU!!!  Are you going to tell me you WILL NOT do this?  If I were a Muslim, I would seek you out and BEHEAD YOU until you're dead, dead, dead!  That's what I would do if I were a Muslim and that is your order AS a Muslim!

 Quran (5:33) - "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His messenger and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement"  This one is special.  Why?  You quote the verse just before this one (Sura 5:32) and call Islam peaceful.  What you don't tell us is what the next verse says which is quoted just above.  Kill the people who won't follow Muhammad since Allah really doesn't exist in the first place.  Here is Sura 5:32.  On that account: We ordained for the Children of Israel that if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people. Then although there came to them Our apostles with clear signs, yet, even after that, many of them continued to commit excesses in the land.  Here is a web page showing evidence of how you Muslims take you own Quran out of context.  http://www.emuslim.com/islamagainstVoilence.asp

Quran (8:12) - "I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"  Very evil verse. 

Quran (9:5) - "So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captive and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them." So, once their little treaty was completed, Muhammad and his evil followers did this and it is still valid practice today.  Maybe you need to join the Muslim Brotherhood.  If you were to talk to them, this is what they do in the name of Islam.  Like it or not, this is Muhammad's commandment!  Follow it or true Muslims will kill you!!!  If you hate killing people, then don't be a Muslim anymore!  If you don't mind killing people, read on!

 Quran (9:14) - "Fight them, Allah will punish them by your hands and bring them to disgrace..."  Are you seriously wanting to worship THIS god???  This god wants YOU to do the killing for him.  I find the Quran very simple to read.  It gets right to the point.  No mincing words.  This god, who created ME as something else other than a Muslim wants me dead, dead, dead!  Now, why would your loving Allah do such an evil act?  Tell me.  Would you kill your children? 

Quran (9:29) - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued." We Christians and Jews ARE the people of the book, (also known as the Bible) you are ORDERED to kill!  No exceptions!!  Once again, these are the words of your wonderful prophet, Muhammad!

Quran (9:73) - "O Prophet! strive hard against the unbelievers and the hypocrites and be unyielding to them; and their abode is hell, and evil is the destination." Muslims want nothing more than to degrade ANYBODY who is NOT Muslim.  What do the true Christians want to do to Muslims?  Lead them to salvation.  Show them that the real God is not a hateful god.  Your god, Allah, is a hateful god.  Your Quran is so simple to read and understand.  No complications understanding the meaning of of it.  The only difficulty I had was understanding Arabic translations of words.  Once I understood that, it's all very simple!

 Quran (9:111) - "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Quran: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme." Pretty much self explanatory.  Go kill the infedels!  Pretty basic instructions, if you ask me!  To fight throughout all these verses so far are referring to death to the infedel! 

So, what do we do with you If you decide at this point, that this book called the Quran is a lie?  Well, have I got a surprise for you right out of the Quran that instructs me just how to deal with this very circumstance.  It is clear quite clear that under Islamic Law an apostate must be put to death. There is no dispute on this ruling among classical Muslim or modern scholars... Sura II.217 is interpreted by no less an authority than al-Shafi'i(died 820 C.E.), the founder of one of the four orthodox schools of law of Sunni Islam to mean that the death penalty should be prescribed for apostates. Sura II.217 reads: "... But whoever of you recants and dies an unbeliever , his works shall come to nothing in this world and the next, and they are the companions of the fire for ever." Al-Thalabi and al -Khazan concur. Al-Razi in his commentary on II:217 says the apostate should be killed . Similarly, IV. 89: "They would have you disbelieve as they themselves have disbelieved, so that you may be all like alike. Do not befriend them until they have fled their homes for the cause of God. If they desert you seize them and put them to death wherever you find them. Look for neither friends nor helpers among them..." Baydawi (died c. 1315-16), in his celebrated commentary on the Koran, interprets this passage to mean: "Whosover turns back from his belief ( irtada ), openly or secretly, take him and kill him wheresoever ye find him, like any other infidel. Separate yourself from him altogether .Do not accept intercession in his regard". Ibn Kathir in his commentary on this passage quoting Al Suddi (died 745) says that since the unbelievers had manifested their unbelief they should be killed.

Man, do I want to be a Muslim.  I will have so much killing to do!  Yeah........Right!

Back to killing verses!

 Quran (9:123) - "O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness."  I truly see this in you Muj.


Quran (17:16) - "And when We wish to destroy a town, We send Our commandment to the people of it who lead easy lives, but they transgress therein; thus the word proves true against it, so We destroy it with utter destruction."  Note that the crime is moral transgression, and the punishment is "utter destruction."  (Before ordering the 9/11 attacks, Osama bin Laden first issued Americans an invitation to Islam). 

Just a little in-house cleanup!
Quran (18:65-81) - This parable lays the theological groundwork for honor killings, in which a family member is murdered because they brought shame to the family, either through apostasy or perceived moral indiscretion.  The story (which is not found in any Jewish or Christian source) tells of Moses encountering a man with "special knowledge" who does things which don't seem to make sense on the surface, but are then justified according to later explanation.  One such action is to murder a youth for no apparent reason (74).  However, the wise man later explains that it was feared that the boy would "grieve" his parents by "disobedience and ingratitude."  He was killed so that Allah could provide them a 'better' son.  (Note: This is one reason why honor killing is sanctioned by Sharia.  Reliance of the Traveler (Umdat al-Saliq) says that punishment for murder is not applicable when a parent or grandparent kills their offspring (o.1.1-2).)

Quran (33:60-62) - "If the hypocrites, and those in whose hearts is a disease, and the alarmists in the city do not cease, We verily shall urge thee on against them, then they will be your neighbors in it but a little while.  Accursed, they will be seized wherever found and slain with a (fierce) slaughter."   This passage sanctions the slaughter (rendered "merciless" and "horrible murder" in other translations) against three groups: Hypocrites (Muslims who refuse to "fight in the way of Allah" (3:167) and hence don't act as Muslims should), those with "diseased hearts" (which include Jews and Christians 5:51-52), and "alarmists" or "agitators who include those who merely speak out against Islam, according to Muhammad's biographers.  It is worth noting that the victims are to be sought out by Muslims, which is what today's terrorists do.  If this passage is meant merely to apply to the city of Medina, then it is unclear why it is included in Allah's eternal word to Muslim generations.


So, how many more hateful killing verses are there in this "so called" peace loving religion?  How about 123 verses in all.

 Quran (47:3-4) - "Those who reject Allah follow vanities, while those who believe follow the truth from their lord.  Thus does Allah set forth form men their lessons by similitude.  Therefore when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them, then make (them) prisoners,"  Those who reject Allah are to be subdued in battle.  The verse goes on to say the only reason Allah doesn't do the dirty work himself is in order to to test the faithfulness of Muslims.  Those who kill pass the test. "But if it had been Allah's Will, He could certainly have exacted retribution from them (Himself); but (He lets you fight) in order to test you, some with others. But those who are slain in the Way of Allah,- He will never let their deeds be lost." So, if you truly want to please Allah, KILL THE INFEDELS!!!!!!

Quran (47:35) - "Be not weary and faint-hearted, crying for peace, when ye should be uppermost (Shakir: "have the upper hand") for Allah is with you,"  So, you're better than us Christians and Jews?  well, OK then!

Quran (48:29) - "Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard (ruthless) against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves"  Islam is not about treating everyone equally.  There are two very distinct standards that are applied based on religious status.  Also the word used for 'hard' or 'ruthless' in this verse shares the same root as the word translated as 'painful' or severe' in verse 16.

 Quran (61:4) - "Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way"  Religion of Peace, indeed! The verse explicitly refers to "battle array" meaning that it is speaking of physical conflict.  This is followed by (61:9): "He it is who has sent His Messenger (Mohammed) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam) to make it victorious over all religions even though the infidels may resist."  (See next verse, below).  Infidels who resist Islamic rule are to be fought.

Quran (61:10-12) - "O You who believe! Shall I guide you to a commerce that will save you from a painful torment. That you believe in Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad ), and that you strive hard and fight in the Cause of Allah with your wealth and your lives, that will be better for you, if you but know! (If you do so) He will forgive you your sins, and admit you into Gardens under which rivers flow, and pleasant dwelling in Gardens of 'Adn - Eternity ['Adn (Edn) Paradise], that is indeed the great success."  This verse refers to physical battle in order to make Islam victorious over other religions (see above).  It uses the Arabic word, Jihad.

Quran (66:9) - "O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey's end."  The root word of "Jihad" is used again here.  The context is clearly holy war, and the scope of violence is broadened to include "hypocrites" - those who call themselves Muslims but do not act as such.  Is this you, Muj?

Some references in the Hadith and other books of Islam.

WHY DO YOU SUBSTITUTE THE WORD INFIDEL (DISBELIEVER) with PEOPLE WHY ARE YOU DELIBERATELY MISUNDERSTANDING THE INSTUCTIONS OF GOD>

THE ENEMIES OF GOD- ATHEIST POLYTHEIST MISHIEF MAKERS AMONGST THE JEWS (ZIONIST) AND ARMIES THAT KILL INNOCENT CIVILLIANS.

WHO IS KILLING THE INNOCENTS?? THE ARMIES OF GOD (muslims)?? or the ARMIES OF ISRAEL AND AMERICA??? DO A rough count of the jewish invasion of the holy land trampling the soil, desecrating Churches killing the Arabs irrespective of Religion, (muslim and Christian) Are these not the enemies of GOD???

Your Bias is clouding your Judgment, You either on the side of the enemies of ALLAH (GOD or you on the side of the Infidel)

SAMSON KILLED 1000 men with the Jawbone of an ass, David Slew Goliath, there has always been an Army for God on earth, there will always be one

The Question is are you willing to submit your will to the will of God.


ON A PERSONAL NOTE: MUSLIMS MAY NOT KILL ANYONE UNLESS THEY ARE LEAD BY AMEERUL MUMINEEEN, (LEADER OF THE BELIEVERS)
MUSLIMS MAY NOT AMBUSH OR TERRORISE INNOCENT CIVILIANS, nor carry out SUICIDE BOMBINGS, it is not Allowed in ISLAM

THERE ARE STRICT RULES OF ENGAGEMENT BEFORE JIHAAD IS UNDERTAKEN.

YOU MAY NOT READ THE QURAN IN ISOLATION OR YOU WILL PUT YOUR OWN INTERPRETATION ACCORDING TO YOUR STATE OF MIND THAT YOU CLEARLY ESTABLISHED HERE>

[Bistabuster]

You apparently are definitely ignoring all those orders that Muhammad told you to do.  Apparently, it is you who is ignorant (no prejudice intended) that you can't see the evil intent of your very own prophet who intentionally killed people because of his own greed.

You truly fit rev 17:17 as I have stated earlier.   God (Yahweh), not Allah, has hardened your heart to a point where you no longer are able to seek and find the truth. With ALL the evidence that surrounds you, you are unable to locate it. Instead, you follow your own carnal, corrupted heart that Yahweh is no a part of because you are the object that Yahweh will use to fulfill His plan. 

The beast is Islam and they (you too being part of that group) will lose.  That time is near where you just might see the coming is our Lord and savior, Jesus and you will mourn when you see that. Maybe you might question Jesus as to why He isn't killing all the Jews. I'll tell you why. Jesus IS a Jew. That's why.


If I were you, I'd reconsider your position. If you want to be on the winning side, I'd suggest that you think very seriously about the implications that you WILL lose. Are you willing to bet your life on Muhammad?  The man who did nothing for nobody or for Jesus who died for you?

Yeah, I know. Muhammad is your man. Well, then you will die for his honor?  You know. The man who could care less about you and you want him to be your role model?  Are you that dense?  You obviously have no clue that Muhammad was in it for himself. Muhammad alone wanted the power and everything that goes with it and to be worshipped. Muhammad gives nothing in return. Muhammad created Islam. It never existed before him. The pieces to create Islam were in place so that Muhammad could start his personalized religion to his liking. Why do you think abrogation (Sura 2:106) is in the quran in the first place?  Because Muhammad created the Quran!  Muhammad thought certain ways of life everybody would follow willingly but he soon realized that didn't work so therefore Muhammad had to abrogate his previously stated revelation and tweak it to make it work the way Muhammad intended it to work. In other words, Muhammad was mistake prone. Think about it. If Allah really did talk to Muhammad and told him to recite this and that and later Allah said "oops, made a mistake. Change it around to this instead" tells me Allah is not wise, all knowing. Gods don't make mistakes. Apparently, this god, Allah, does.

[Bistabuster]

My dear sir. Patronizing me is cheap shot. It doe not become you as you very bad at.

I do not patronize nobody.  I tell a truth that you refuse to listen to because you are so engrossed in Islam.  More on this later.

I am here because in my experience no Christian takes the time and trouble to find God.

  I have 27 years of experience of study in many aspects of the Bible dealing with salvation, prophecy, marriage, the trinity and a few other controversial subject matters.  Again.  More about this later.

Most Christians have not read scripture objectively or took the time and trouble to question what they have been presented with. Blind faith of sheep leading sheep.

Again.  27 years isn't enough study time?  I can't say 100 years because I am not that old so that's not possible.

I have had the good fortune of having had ver good fathers of the St Paul's church kindly educating me in all subjects from English my first language to math and yes the scripture. Mass and evangelism and holy communion was a subject I was tested on in examinations.

I don't know what they taught you and what origin of faith they proclaim to be (sounds like Catholic to me)  but from your fruits, either they told you what we told you and you disapproved in some way or they told you some form that is not Scriptural.  Catholics do have a funny way of reading Scriptures though.

My rejection of opinion and conjecture in favor of truth is a matter or simply seeking The Lord God's guidance by making the effort to find the truth by piecing together history from phd scholars all over the world.

  The Quran truth is of one man, Muhammad of whom did not want to find out what to really worship.  It is very clear to me that Muhammad wanted you to worship Muhammad.  Actually, that's not entirely true.  Muhammad wanted people of his day to worship him.  It just so happened that people, like you, believed his lies completely that most all Muslims fail to see beyond Muhammad's vision.  Once again, more on this too later.  All of this ties in to one lump sum.


Now, do you think I will become a Muslim because you say it is the real religion?  I would be stupid if I did.  I don't expect you to become a Christian in like manner.  Just because you say Islam is the real deal, doesn't make it so.  Works both ways, my friend!

All the stuff Ex-Military and Pete said I will not believe.  Just like you, Pete doesn't know what he's talking about.  And Ex-Military?  Nobody believes him.  I haven't believed him in years!!  Why is that?  What makes me not believe these two people?  Because they teach what I don't agree with?  That's EXACTLY why I totally and completely disagree with them both!  They need to think before they speak.

Now, suppose Ex-Military came up with Islam is meant to be this way and provides nothing to back it up.  This is what Ex-Military does ALL THE TIME!!!  When I ask Ex-Military (as I have done over a hundred times) and he refuses to supply the proof that I asked for, I have no choice but to say his doctrine is FALSE!  I will no longer trust his form of doctrine! 

But say Ex-Military provides multiple things to back up his claim, I still call him wrong!  And Pete, well, he is in cahoots with Ex so we can't trust either one of them because I have already made up my mind that whatever they say will be false!  Let's face it.  Why trust either one of them.  They're worthless to you and me, right?

Now, suppose they are absolutely correct.  Who's at fault now?  Me.  The reason is that since these two people provided information FOR YOU AND ME TO LOOK UP AND REVIEW, but you and I decided that we are just not going to do that because we have already decided they are in error. 

That, my friend, is NOT how I operate.  I also know for a FACT that this is not how either Ex-Military and Pete operate either!!  According to the fruits I see as of right now, you do indeed operate in this fashion.  You lack investigative skills as of right now.  I am not denying that you studied in the past and came up with a conclusion, far from it.  You are, however doing that now with us.  You have already set in your mind that Christians know nothing but Muslims do based on your past studies.  Particularly Muhammad's viewpoint.  If I don't know something anybody said about the Bible or even Islam, but they left a paper trail to follow as their information and proof that lead them to that conclusion, I will investigate it on the basis that they just might be right with an open mind without being firm with what I currently think it should be because I just might be reading it all wrong.  You will never know unless you take that leap and take a chance on learning what it is that they said instead of being hard headed and throw it in the trash bin!

Now, as I have told you earlier, I have done extensive study of the Bible for 27 years.  I wanted to know if I could trust that book (the Bible).  The first thing I needed to know if if the Bible was a valid book or just some piece of garbage I shouldn't be reading at all.  The Bible is one of the HARDEST books to understand EVER!!!  No one will ever understand that book completely.  The Bible is a book of mystery.  To understand Yahweh's ways is just not possible.  We, as human beings are incapable of understanding the fullness of Yahweh.  He just gave us what we need to know now.  One thing Yahweh made very clear is that Yahweh is a God of love.  This God loves EVERYBODY unlike Allah which only loves who Allah picks and chooses.  Evidence to support this claim.

Qur’an 3:31-32—Say [O Muhammad]: If you love Allah, then follow me, Allah will love you and forgive you your faults, and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. Say: Obey Allah and the Apostle; but if they turn back, then surely Allah does not love the unbelievers.

Qur’an 30:43-45—Then turn thy face straight to the right religion before there come from Allah the day which cannot be averted; on that day they shall become separated. Whoever disbelieves, he shall be responsible for his disbelief, and whoever does good, they prepare (good) for their own souls, that He may reward those who believe and do good out of His grace; surely He does not love the unbelievers.

 This make Allah a conditional god.  This simply means that you must love god first, then god will love you back.

1 John 4:19  We love him, because he first loved us.

Romans 5:8 But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

1 John 4:16 So we have come to know and to believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and whoever abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.

Totally the opposite.  God loved us first.  This God's love is unconditional.  Allah's love to us is conditional.  We MUST love Allah first.  It's clear as clear can be.  Romans 5:8 testifies to that!  Do you want a god to only love you IF....or would you prefer a God to love you anyway, just the way you are, so imperfect?  The way I see it, since I was born a sinner and there's nothing I can do about that AND I was not born in a Muslim community, God still loves me just the same as He loves everybody else that he created EQUALLY!  God doesn't love you more than me or God doesn't love me more than you.  You and I with Pete and Ex-Military along with everybody else all the same.

Moving on.  Slight sidetrack there!

 
 
During my studies of the Bible, I found that I needed to understand Islam.  Islam is mentioned in the Bible in prophecy.  I needed to fully understand what Islam was in order to understand what the prophecies in the Bible were all about.  I have about 19 years of study on Islam alone.  I needed to know the history of Islam, its origins, who created it and when and what not.  That took a while.  That's because the Quran is so poorly written.  There are mistakes far too many that if I were to become a Muslim and follow Muhammad (which is exactly what ALL Muslims are ordered to do in the first place), I wouldn't know what I was supposed to do.  The contradictions are far to great to comprehend.  I then began to understand how the peaceful verses you like to quote extensively is the Meccan period of Muhammad's life.  You are absolutely correct that Islam was peaceful.  That only lasted for a very short time.  Since extremely few people sided with Muhammad in his vision as to how they (the Meccans) should worship, he left Mecca and the second phase of Muhammad life came into play.  The Medinan period.  For about ten years in Medina, Muhammad, who was a military commander, gathered an army big enough to destroy Mecca.  That's where chapter 9 in the Quran comes in.  The verse of the sword.  You should already know that one. 

Once I understood the 23 year history of Muhammad, both the Quran AND the Bible became VERY clear to me.  The Bible predicted that we will be at war with Islam until Jesus returns.  This has been going on since the inception of Islam.  That could be at any time now.  I don't know when that time will be but it is very close.  We are in the last days right now.

So, I am not some stupid blind duma$$ that follows some cheesy dimwit who says Christians are to do this or that like lemmings?  You have a lot to learn as to what a Christian is and we (Pete, Ex-Military as well as myself) will help you along the way to understand what we really are.  You are misguided as to what you think we are.

[PeteWaldo]

I'm going to try to straighten up Muj's post with an edit. You would think after 426 posts he would have had the decency and common courtesy to learn how to quote a post. Yet as many times as this has come up, he still couldn't be botherED, but leaves his posting confusion to be straightened up by others.

[Bistabuster]

So how can someone that pretends to have read scripture, not have noticed those verses?

Looking at this differently as pertaining to the Islamic references, I fail to see how any human being can follow such a book(s).  It's such a disgrace to humankind.  Muhammad was a total disgrace to life.

There is only one logical reason that I can think of that will entice people to follow that smut.  They're demented and totally insane.  Likes the fact of killing people and blowing themselves up.  Maybe they just love hateful verses.

That's my take on it.  When I read the Quran, that's what I see.  The only good thing about that book is that it gets right to the point and tells you exactly what to do.  No mincing words.

The mincing word comes along when a Christian asks a Muslim to explain why the Quran orders Muslims to kill, kill, kill.  Then the Muslims just dash around the questions refusing to directly answer these questions.  We ask, does the Quran instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers?  The correct answer is yes but Muslims refuse to say that for various reasons.  One reason is that they know it says that but they don't want to admit to that fact because it degrades the Quran into some barbaric killing machine doctrine when these Muslims are trying to pass it off as peaceful, which it isn't.  Muslims just dance around that question or just avoid it altogether.

[PeteWaldo]

We ask, does the Quran instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers?  The correct answer is yes but Muslims refuse to say that for various reasons.

It's because they know that the Quran implicates their deity - that the Arabian pagan's named "Allah" - as being the terrorist. Who, along with his "messenger", are revealed as morally reprobate, murdering, terrorizing, prisoner abusing, slave making, thieves, of Yahweh's people and property.

Qur'an 33:26 "Allah took down the People of the Scripture Book. He cast terror into their hearts. Some you slew, and some you made prisoners. And He made you heirs of their lands, their houses, and their goods, giving you a land which you had not traversed before. And Allah has power over all things."

[Bistabuster]

Again, if Muslims really want to find the real God, why would they waste their time reading this garbage?  Another point being is that their god Allah fills their hearts desires right now!  Along with that, they seem to think that the life they have right now will carry out in the afterlife equally as it does in this life.  Allah will again will fill their hearts desires to whatever they want in both realms.


Won't they be surprised when it all falls apart when they finally realize that they (Muslims) fell for the oldest trick in the book and only realize it when it's too late!  Unfortunately, for most Muslims, that's what it's going to take when the truth finally hits them and they (Muslims) will be begging for mercy of which they will not receive at all.  It will have to take a drastic turn of events, even death, to open their eyes and see that Muhammad and his religion, Islam, was never the truth.

Matthew 13:13-16  This is why I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. Indeed, in their case the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled that says: “‘You will indeed hear but never understand, and you will indeed see but never perceive. For this people's heart has grown dull, and with their ears they can barely hear, and their eyes they have closed, lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears and understand with their heart and turn, and I would heal them.’ But blessed are your eyes, for they see, and your ears, for they hear.

[Mujaheed]

Again, if Muslims really want to find the real God, why would they waste their time reading this garbage?  Another point being is that their god Allah fills their hearts desires right now!  Along with that, they seem to think that the life they have right now will carry out in the afterlife equally as it does in this life.  Allah will again will fill their hearts desires to whatever they want in both realms.


Won't they be surprised when it all falls apart when they finally realize that they (Muslims) fell for the oldest trick in the book and only realize it when it's too late!  Unfortunately, for most Muslims, that's what it's going to take when the truth finally hits them and they (Muslims) will be begging for mercy of which they will not receive at all.  It will have to take a drastic turn of events, even death, to open their eyes and see that Muhammad and his religion, Islam, was never the truth.

Matthew 13:13-16  This is why I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. Indeed, in their case the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled that says: “‘You will indeed hear but never understand, and you will indeed see but never perceive. For this people's heart has grown dull, and with their ears they can barely hear, and their eyes they have closed, lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears and understand with their heart and turn, and I would heal them.’ But blessed are your eyes, for they see, and your ears, for they hear.

YOU ARE SO FAR THE TRUTH I DON'T even know where to start correcting your false rhetoric borne out of the brainwashing of western religion that is deviated by the very Roman Catholics you so despise.

Mathew 13:13-16 is Spot on for the Christians, You are deaf dumb and blind as far as scripture is concerned. You deaf dumb and blind as far as Jesus is concerned, you are def dumb and blind as far as the first and most important of all commands are concerned. HEAR YE O' Isrel The lord Your GOD IS ON,

Quran say SUMMUN BUKMUN UMYUN, FAHUM LAARYARJIOON, DEF DUMB AND BLIND SURA BAQARA,

Ayah 1     
Yusuf Ali           A.L.M.
Transliteration   Alif La_m Mim.
Ayah 2     
Yusuf Ali           This is the Book; in it is guidance sure without doubt to those who fear Allah.
Transliteration   Za_likal kita_bu la_ raiba fihi hudal lilmuttaqin(a).
Ayah 3     
Yusuf Ali           Who believe in the Unseen are steadfast in prayer and spend out of what We have provided for them.
Transliteration   Allazina yu'minu_na bil gaibi wa yuqimu_nas sala_ta wa mimma_ razaqna_hum yunfiqu_n(a).
Ayah 4     
Yusuf Ali           And who believe in the Revelation sent to thee and sent before thy time and (in their hearts) have the assurance of the Hereafter.
Transliteration   Wallazina yu'minu_na bima_ unzila ilaika wa ma_ unzila min qablika, wabil a_khirati hum ya_qinu_n(a).
Ayah 5     
Yusuf Ali           They are on (true) guidance from their Lord and it is these who will prosper.
Transliteration   Ula_'ika 'ala_ hudam mir rabbihim wa ula_'ika humul muflihu_n(a)
Ayah 6     
Yusuf Ali           As to those who reject Faith it is the same to them whether thou warn them or do not warn them; they will not believe.
Transliteration   Innal lazina kafaru_ sawa_'un 'alaihim a'anzartahum am lam tunzirhum la_ yu'minu_n(a).
Ayah 7     
Yusuf Ali           Allah hath set a seal on their hearts and on their hearing and on their eyes is a veil; great is the penalty they (incur).
Transliteration   Khatamalla_hu 'ala_ qulu_bihim wa 'ala_ sam'ihim, wa 'ala_ absa_rihim gisya_watuw walahum 'aza_bun 'azim(un).
 

YOU ARE THE PROOF THAT THE QURAN IS 100% correct and spot on when it comes to all matters pertaining to human beings and the current situation we find ourselves in.

[Bistabuster]

YOU ARE SO FAR THE TRUTH I DON'T even know where to start correcting your false rhetoric borne out of the brainwashing of western religion that is deviated by the very Roman Catholics you so despise.

The reason you think we don't know the truth is because you fill your head with Muhammad's gross form of belief that is so outrageous that one, if he were intelligent enough, he would be able to see that it is a load of hogwash.

I have read your Quran, through and through.  I know it upside down and inside out.  You refuse to go to that extreme to do the same for the Bible, although you say you did but you didn't.  Meaning, if you studied the Bible at all, either it didn't make sense to you or that the Bible's teachings were either too strict for you or leads you down a path that you just simply don't want to travel down.  I could see you going either way on this one.

So, without ANY knowledge whatsoever of the Bible, you have no trouble bashing it down our throats.

Why in the world would I even want to become a Muslim and worship Muhammad?  Apparently, Muhammad attracts you in some way or another.  Is it because Muhammad told you what you want to hear?  You know.  The desires of your heart?  What turned you on to Muhammad?  Screw the verses of the Quran and other documented sources.  I want to know what made you follow Muhammad, not Allah, Muhammad.

[Bistabuster]

Anybody know what a brick wall is?  If you're going to condemn something, back it up with proof.  We'll start here.

Who can alter the Quran?  Well, only one.

Sura 6:34  and there is none to change the words of Allah....

Then we have this.

Sura 2:106  We do not abrogate a verse or cause it to be forgotten except that We bring forth [one] better than it or similar to it. Do you not know that Allah is over all things competent?

What is abrogation?  http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/abrogate

Here we clearly have something in the Quran that was imperfect.  It needed to either be altered or completely removed to be replaced with a better reference.  Sura 2:107 also verifies who can alter the Quran   

Sura 2:107  Do you not know that to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and [that] you have not besides Allah any protector or any helper?

Question.  What had to be replaced and how much of the Quran was affected by this one verse?

We have a few problems here.  Since some verses have been abrogated and we were not told which ones were abrogated and the abrogated verses were left intact in the Quran giving us polar opposites as to what Allah wants us to do with the new revelations, so which one do we follow?  So, here I come, being a brand new Muslim with absolutely no clue about Islam, come across these two verses.

2:256 Let there be no compulsion in religion: ...
and
Sura 8:12  I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them

So, these are both in the Quran as open ended phrases, meaning, it is not set in a particular point of time.  It is forever.  It didn't say smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them in this battle or if they attack you first or any other conditional environment. 

Also, since Allah alone can only alter the book, not Muhammad, not Jesus, not me and not you, only Allah and Allah alone, then who is "WE"?  Yes, I quoted DIRECTLY from you very own Quran.  All texts say the very same thing.  There is a "WE" located twice in Sura 2:106 AND WE is capitalized!  So the question is....Allah and what army has the privilege to alter the Quran?

There is a direct and violent contradiction right there in your very own personalized uncorrupted book you call the Quran.  It is there for any and all intelligent people to see and read.  Nothing mysterious about it.  It says what it means and it means what it says.  There is no hidden agenda in that reference.  Clear as clear can be.

Why is it so hard for you to see this?  Why is it you refuse to place some common sense and listen to what you are reading?  My 10 year old kid can make perfect sense of this verse without me indoctrinating or brainwashing him to believe what it isn't.  Open up your eyes and pay attention to what your Quran says.  STOP BELIEVING IT WITHOUT PUTTING IT (the Quran) TO THE TEST!

[Mujaheed]

Anybody know what a brick wall is?  If you're going to condemn something, back it up with proof.  We'll start here.

Who can alter the Quran?  Well, only one.

Sura 6:34  and there is none to change the words of Allah....

Then we have this.

Sura 2:106  We do not abrogate a verse or cause it to be forgotten except that We bring forth [one] better than it or similar to it. Do you not know that Allah is over all things competent?

What is abrogation?  http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/abrogate

Here we clearly have something in the Quran that was imperfect.  It needed to either be altered or completely removed to be replaced with a better reference.  Sura 2:107 also verifies who can alter the Quran   

Sura 2:107  Do you not know that to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and [that] you have not besides Allah any protector or any helper?

Question.  What had to be replaced and how much of the Quran was affected by this one verse?

We have a few problems here.  Since some verses have been abrogated and we were not told which ones were abrogated and the abrogated verses were left intact in the Quran giving us polar opposites as to what Allah wants us to do with the new revelations, so which one do we follow?  So, here I come, being a brand new Muslim with absolutely no clue about Islam, come across these two verses.

2:256 Let there be no compulsion in religion: ...
and
Sura 8:12  I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them

So, these are both in the Quran as open ended phrases, meaning, it is not set in a particular point of time.  It is forever.  It didn't say smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them in this battle or if they attack you first or any other conditional environment. 

Also, since Allah alone can only alter the book, not Muhammad, not Jesus, not me and not you, only Allah and Allah alone, then who is "WE"?  Yes, I quoted DIRECTLY from you very own Quran.  All texts say the very same thing.  There is a "WE" located twice in Sura 2:106 AND WE is capitalized!  So the question is....Allah and what army has the privilege to alter the Quran?

There is a direct and violent contradiction right there in your very own personalized uncorrupted book you call the Quran.  It is there for any and all intelligent people to see and read.  Nothing mysterious about it.  It says what it means and it means what it says.  There is no hidden agenda in that reference.  Clear as clear can be.

Why is it so hard for you to see this?  Why is it you refuse to place some common sense and listen to what you are reading?  My 10 year old kid can make perfect sense of this verse without me indoctrinating or brainwashing him to believe what it isn't.  Open up your eyes and pay attention to what your Quran says.  STOP BELIEVING IT WITHOUT PUTTING IT (the Quran) TO THE TEST!

Tell me are you simpleton, a little slow to grasp simple logic?

I have asked you and many like you not to read the Quran line by line,

These are the Words of GOD and UNGODLY souls have serious difficulty understanding the words of GOD.

There is no contradiction anywhere in the Quran.  One verse pertaining to war and protecting believers from Kaafir (disbelievers) will invite individuals to strive with their wealth and their lives to fight for the Deen (way) of ALLAH in order that real and lasting peace can be reached.

The other Verse pertains to a Conquered land and people, Nowhere in history did Muslims ever force conversion on a population by any means.
To this day Jihaad is fought against the ENEMIES OF GOD!!!! 

Muslims do not fight to convert people. THE QURAN CLEARLY STATES THAT ALLAH GUIDES WHOM HE WILLS> ALLAH LEAVES TO GO ASTRAY WHOM HE WILLS>

ALL THE WORLD DID NOT FOLLOW ANY OF THE PROPHETS THAT WERE SENT, A VERY SMALL PERCETAGE OF THE WORLD POPULATION ACTUALLY BELIEVES AND OBEY THE COMMANDS OF GOD< 90% of the Population of Earth is in pursuit of a means of living or wealth the line is blurred somewhere along the path when the person starts using more than he needs.

WHAT IS REMARKABLE IS THAT THE QURAN ADDRESSES EACH AND EVERYONE OF THESE HUMAN CONDITIONS AND PRESENTS THE SOLUTION FOR THAT CONDITION IN ORDER FOR THE PERSON TO REACH ALLAH all mighty. Hence the apparent contradictions.

Read the Quran in Totality not according to your feeble intellect that is so full of faults that I do not wish to insult you with a list.

[Bistabuster]

Well, that settles it.  There is no doubt that you are brainwashed and you are definitely hooked into its lies.  You are under God's command and he has your heart hardened to a point where you CANNOT go to paradise or wherever you think you are going because of this one verse.

Rev 17:17  For God hath put in their hearts to fulfill his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

In order for the last days before Jesus returns to be accomplished, God needs you to be against Him so that His plan can be fulfilled.  Congratulations on setting your place OPPOSITE of the real God.  Continue worshiping Satan for he has total control of your heart and you don't even realize it.

Read the Quran in Totality not according to your feeble intellect that is so full of faults that I do not wish to insult you with a list.

Who taught you that crap?  Do you not understand English?  I think not.  Let me try one more time.  Listen VERY CAREFULLY for I am going to make this statement VERY CLEAR that even a two year old can understand, OK?  If you are older than two years old and still do not understand, then you are a deluded brainwashed person.

I have read the Quran and associated other doctrines that go along with the Quran.  I have studied its history as to how it began and why.  I have been studying Islam for 19 years and with ALL the history and the evidence both written in all the books with the historical fact associated with the writings, one has no choice (except you of coarse) to say that Islam is a fraud.  However, people, like you need to believe in this trash in order for Rev 13, Rev 11 and many other references in the Bible to be able to fulfill themselves of which you personally are providing the grand conclusion to the world as we know it.  My God gave us a look into what is going to happen and He's right on target, as usual.  The Bible was never altered since 100 AD and so far it has predicted the Dome of the Rock as an eyesore to God in 688-691 AD, the first Jihad that you are so proud of until Charles Martel destroyed your faithful Muslims in the Battle of Tours.  That too was predicted in our corrupted Bible, as you like to put it.  Then we have WW2 where the Jews will get killed (Boy, I know if you were alive during that time, all hail to Hitler, baby!  You'd love it) and the true Muslims, which I'm not sure you are one of those yet but I tend to walk that way, will say that there will be another Hitler and this time, the Muslims will finish the job.  Destroy any and all Jews.  Then we move on to 1967.  Here we have the six day war.  The PLO lost!  Then the PLO got pissed because they lost control of Israel.  Then they decided from that day forward that nothing will stand in their way to get it back.  Sorry.  You can kiss this one goodbye and move on to something else for my God will keep you from it.  It's not yours nor has it ever been yours to begin with.  Like what the originator of Islam did in the beginning (his name is Muhammad.  You know.  You're favorite hero?) he stole pretty much everything he got.  That's history.  If you're too stupid to see through your prophet, then you have the same mindset AS your all wonderful prophet.  A corrupted mind.

This all was predicted LONG before your beloved prophet was even born.  So, what did Muhammad predict that came true long after he died?


That's it.  There is NOTHING!!!  Not one event came true.  No battles, no specific events.  No nothing.  And you think he wonderful.  Please.  Get real.

[Bistabuster]

One more note Muj.  The Quran is a simpleton book.  Let's try your hand with these verses in the Bible. 

Pay attention.  I want you to tell me what they mean and who or what they are talking about.  I'll only give you four verses to look at.

Rev 11:3-4  And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

For this one, who, or what, is the two witnesses?  Be exact in your detail of each one of them.

Rev 13 1-2  And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.  And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

Here we have a bunch of stuff.  Again, what are these things?  They mean something, but what?  A beast rising up out of the sea that looks like a leopard and a bear and a lion?  Exactly, what is this beast?  What is it supposed to be, really?  Then we have the dragon.  What does this mean?  Tell me in great detail how you will see this event in the real world. 

Rev 12:3-4  And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.  And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth:

a dragon with seven heads and ten horns?  What does that mean?  Could we really be talking about a real dragon described like that?  If not, then what?  Tell me what the stars the dragon's tail took and cast them to earth.  Exactly what's that?  Study, study, study. 

Rev 10  And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Who or what is the beast?  What about the false prophet?  Who or what are they.  Show me evidence to all these passages and make some sense of them.  There is a pattern to all of this unless you know where to look.  Hint.  Muhammad is not where you find these answers.  The sooner you understand this, the better you'll be.  If you knew EXACTLY what each and every verse I gave you meant in great detail, you would be begging to leave Islam! 

So, is the Bible a simpleton book?  Not one bit.  As far as the Quran and its associated documents go, it gets right to the point.  Why do you think Middle Eastern Muslims cut the heads off Christians?  It's because this verse tells them too. 

Sura 8:12  I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them

No mincing words with Muhammad.  Muhammad says what he means and means what he says!  That is, if the thing he said wasn't working to his liking and therefore had to abrogate his first command.   

I find the Quran very easy to understand yet I found the Bible extremely complicated book of mystery.  The Quran tells me straight up what I need to do whereas I have to decipher the Bible to figure out the story behind it.  The Bible takes research to understand it and when you do, it becomes very clear.  If you couldn't answer any of the above verses, then you don't know the Bible as you say you do.

[PeteWaldo]

WHAT IS REMARKABLE IS THAT THE QURAN ADDRESSES EACH AND EVERYONE OF THESE HUMAN CONDITIONS

Yea. If you are a moral reprobate that is hungry and horney, and doesn't want to work for a living, and are a looser when it comes to women, then join Muhammad and you can steal other peoples food and property and rape their little girls and women.

[Bistabuster]

WHAT IS REMARKABLE IS THAT THE QURAN ADDRESSES EACH AND EVERYONE OF THESE HUMAN CONDITIONS

Yea. If you are a moral reprobate that is hungry and horney, and doesn't want to work for a living, and are a looser when it comes to women, then join Muhammad and you can steal other peoples food and property and rape their little girls and women.

That is NOT my lifestyle. I don't a use people of any kind to suit my own needs which is what Islam does.

[PeteWaldo]

WHAT IS REMARKABLE IS THAT THE QURAN ADDRESSES EACH AND EVERYONE OF THESE HUMAN CONDITIONS

Yea. If you are a moral reprobate that is hungry and horney, and doesn't want to work for a living, and are a looser when it comes to women, then join Muhammad and you can steal other peoples food and property and rape their little girls and women.

That is NOT my lifestyle. I don't a use people of any kind to suit my own needs which is what Islam does.

But of course Islam has a 1400 year history of slavery that continues today:
http://www.falseprophetmuhammad.com/islamic_slavery_dhimmitude.htm

[Bistabuster]

I don't think he can figure out any of my verses.  They were complicated to me as well but I studied them carefully.  If only he knew what they were talking about......if only he knew.  The real thing is, does he care?

[Mujaheed]

One more note Muj.  The Quran is a simpleton book.  Let's try your hand with these verses in the Bible. 

Pay attention.  I want you to tell me what they mean and who or what they are talking about.  I'll only give you four verses to look at.

Rev 11:3-4  And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

For this one, who, or what, is the two witnesses?  Be exact in your detail of each one of them.

Rev 13 1-2  And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.  And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

Here we have a bunch of stuff.  Again, what are these things?  They mean something, but what?  A beast rising up out of the sea that looks like a leopard and a bear and a lion?  Exactly, what is this beast?  What is it supposed to be, really?  Then we have the dragon.  What does this mean?  Tell me in great detail how you will see this event in the real world. 

Rev 12:3-4  And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.  And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth:

a dragon with seven heads and ten horns?  What does that mean?  Could we really be talking about a real dragon described like that?  If not, then what?  Tell me what the stars the dragon's tail took and cast them to earth.  Exactly what's that?  Study, study, study. 

Rev 10  And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Who or what is the beast?  What about the false prophet?  Who or what are they.  Show me evidence to all these passages and make some sense of them.  There is a pattern to all of this unless you know where to look.  Hint.  Muhammad is not where you find these answers.  The sooner you understand this, the better you'll be.  If you knew EXACTLY what each and every verse I gave you meant in great detail, you would be begging to leave Islam! 

So, is the Bible a simpleton book?  Not one bit.  As far as the Quran and its associated documents go, it gets right to the point.  Why do you think Middle Eastern Muslims cut the heads off Christians?  It's because this verse tells them too. 

Sura 8:12  I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them

No mincing words with Muhammad.  Muhammad says what he means and means what he says!  That is, if the thing he said wasn't working to his liking and therefore had to abrogate his first command.   

I find the Quran very easy to understand yet I found the Bible extremely complicated book of mystery.  The Quran tells me straight up what I need to do whereas I have to decipher the Bible to figure out the story behind it.  The Bible takes research to understand it and when you do, it becomes very clear.  If you couldn't answer any of the above verses, then you don't know the Bible as you say you do.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH, You hilarious

You asking me to comment on the work of an unknown Author that has absolutely no Prophetic Authority,
Simply put you ignoramus the `DEVIL inspired this book. How do we know for certain is due to the fact that it is Koine Greek (Not written in the Holy land and the imagery describes a demon, a devil or a an antichrist Dajjal)

We start by speculating on who the Author is then we visit the large number of interpretations that is presented ( I know you favor the absurd interpretation of Ellis Skollfield.

NOW YOU ASKING ME TO ADD MY CONJECTURE, OPINION AND SPECULATION TO A BOOK THAT YOU HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO CERTAINTY OF ITS ORIGIN???

The Book of Revelation, often known simply as Revelation or the Apocalypse,[1] is the final book of the New Testament and occupies a central place in Christian eschatology. Written in Koine Greek, its title is derived from the first word of the text, apokalypsis, meaning "unveiling" or "revelation." The author of the work identifies himself in the text as "John" and says that he was on Patmos, an island in the Aegean, when he was instructed by a heavenly figure to write down the contents of a vision. This John is traditionally supposed to be John the Apostle, although some historical-critical scholarship reject this view.[2] Recent scholarship has suggested other possibilities including a putative figure given the name John of Patmos. Most modern scholars believe it was written around AD 95, with some believing it dates from around AD 70.

There are approximately 230 Greek manuscripts available for the reconstructing of the original reading of Revelation. Major texts used are: the uncial scripts Codex Sinaiticus (4th century), Codex Alexandrinus (5th century), and Codex Ephraemi (5th century); the papyri, especially that of p47 (3rd century); the minuscules (8th to 10th century); the church father quotations (2nd to 5th centuries); and the Greek commentary on Revelation by Andreas (6th century).[36] RECONSTRUCTIONS???

The obscure and extravagant[3] imagery has led to a wide variety of interpretations: historicist interpretations see in Revelation a broad view of history; preterist interpretations treat Revelation as mostly referring to the events of the apostolic era (1st century), or—at the latest—the fall of the Roman Empire; futurists believe that Revelation describes future events; and idealist or symbolic interpretations consider that Revelation does not refer to actual people or events, but is an allegory of the spiritual path and the ongoing struggle between good and evil.


IT HAS NO CLEAR MEANING!!!!! EVERYTHING IS SPECUALTION AND CONJECTURE IN ANY ANSWER GIVEN
IF YOU ARROGANT AND INSIST THAT YOUR VIEW IS THE TRUTH YOU NO BETTER THAN A LIAR>

[PeteWaldo]

I don't know why Bista inquired of you regarding the book of Revelation, when Satan prevents you from even being able to understand the Gospel Muj. Maybe he's got a reason.
Though we do understand the why of the affliction of antichrists:

1Cr 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

We can know the book of Revelation was divinely inspired, because so much of the prophecy has been fulfilled. Like most of Chapter 9 as recognized by those great men of God of the Reformation.
http://www.christianeschatology.com/historicism.htm#reformers_on_islam

Reformers on Islam in Prophecy

Of Revelation chapter 9:  John Foxe who authored Foxe’s Book of Martyrs wrote that it is “clearer than light itself” as being a prophecy of the Muslim conquests.

Albert Barnes: “With surprising unanimity, commentators have agreed in regarding this to the empire of the Saracens (Muslims), or to the rise and the progress of the religion and the empire set up by Muhammed.”

W.B. Godbey: “This chapter is a thrilling description of the rise and progress of the Mohammedan wars.”

Of the locusts of Revelation 9:  Adam Clarke: “certainly agrees better with the Saracens than with any other people or nation” and “agrees very well with the troops of Mohammed.”

Matthew Henry: “the armies of the Mohamedan empire.”

John Wesley: “All this agrees with the slaughter which the Saracens made for a long time after Mahomet’s death.”

[Bistabuster]

The reason why I gave him the tough verses is to show he doesn't know the Bible at all.  He can't even understand the simple verses either.  His mind is that of likeness to the murdering Muhammad.  He apparently sees joy in Muhammad's teachings and disgust in the teachings of Jesus.