Author Topic: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam  (Read 6108 times)

Peter

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Quran inspired violence:
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Quran/023-violence.htm
Qur'an (2:191-193) - "And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution  [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non-believers]...
Surah 9.29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. 30 The Jews call Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah. That is a saying from their mouth; (in this) they but imitate what the unbelievers of old used to say. Allah's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!
Allah's Apostle said, You (i.e. Muslims) will fight with the Jews till some of them will hide behind stones. The stones will (betray them) saying, 'O Abdullah (i.e. slave of Allah)! There is a Jew hiding behind me; so kill him.'"
(video) (video) Sahih Bukhari
Hadith Volume 4, Book 52, Number 176 - Sunna: Sahih Muslim Book 041, Number 6985) USC had to remove this "inspired" Islamic hadith as hate speech, but does not repudiate it).
More popular paraphrase: “Jews will hide behind the rock and tree, and the rock and tree will say: oh servant of Allah, oh Muslim, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!”  (video)
Sura 8:12 I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them Sura 9:5  But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war);...
Sura 9:123 O ye who believe! fight the unbelievers . . .
Sura 9.111 Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.
Mohammed even lies about the Gospel in that sura.
Matthew 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

resistingrexmundi

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #1 on: August 21, 2009, 08:26:32 AM »
It amazes me when I hear terms like "moderate muslim" or "liberal muslim" and the way terrorists are labled as extremists. Perhaps they are extreme when viewed through the eyes of peace but through the lense of Islam they are in fact "orthodox". Following in the example of their prophet. Just as Christians should follow in the example of ours. Though He is so much more than a prophet.

In his book, Mark A. Gabriel, discusses the truth of orthodox Islam. For anyone interested in seeing how a real muslim practices his religion this is a great way to do that without tasting the edge of a sword.

God bless
Doth that man love his Lord who would be willing to see Jesus wearing a crown of thorns, while for himself he craves a chaplet of laurel? Shall Jesus ascend to his throne by the cross, and do we expect to be carried there on the shoulders of applauding crowds? Charles H. Spurgeon

Peter

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2009, 08:42:53 AM »
It amazes me when I hear terms like "moderate muslim" or "liberal muslim" and the way terrorists are labled as extremists. Perhaps they are extreme when viewed through the eyes of peace but through the lense of Islam they are in fact "orthodox". Following in the example of their prophet. Just as Christians should follow in the example of ours. Though He is so much more than a prophet.

In his book, Mark A. Gabriel, discusses the truth of orthodox Islam. For anyone interested in seeing how a real muslim practices his religion this is a great way to do that without tasting the edge of a sword.

God bless

There can be no doubt as to which type of Muslim prevails. The fundamentalists would be just as happy cutting the head off of Muslims that pretend Islam is a religion of peace - that fundamentalists believe are apostate - as they are to cut the heads off of infidels.

http://www.tangle.com/view_video?viewkey=88d267dba53d454cb1ed

Peter

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2009, 10:14:01 AM »
Just happened into this interview with a Jihadist regarding exactly what I was talking about. Peaceful Muslims are hypocrites and why they won't stand up to the fundamentalists:
I don't know how to work this site yet but click on the video "Jihad" the blue one with the horse at the right:
http://stephanies.blip.tv/
Very good channel.

SalahDinThe2nD

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2009, 03:32:48 PM »
Quote
Qur'an (2:191-193) - "And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution  [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non-believers]...

Look closer when they drove you out in verses .

bible is full of it too :

Bible Pagan's Laws:
a. Kill Nonbelievers (2 Chronicles 15:12-13).
b. Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God (Deut

13:13-19).
c. Kill Followers of Other Religions. (Deut 13:7-12; Deut 17:2-5;

Exodus 22:19-20).
d. Death for Cursing? Parents (Proverbs 20:20; Leviticus 20:9).
e. Death for Hitting Dad (Exodus 21:15).
f. Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests (Deut 17:12).
g. Eat the FLESH of your children during siege (Deuteronomy 28:53;

Deuteronomy 28:57)

"Thou shalt not kill? (Exodus 20:13)(Deut 5:17) Really ??
Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;

Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;

He begetteth not, nor is He begotten

And there is none like unto Him

resistingrexmundi

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2009, 10:36:43 AM »
[disappeared then restored from database on 10-12-16]

 'Before I address your erroneous claims. I would like to point out that for a group of people who constantly talk about needing to study something in the original language it was written in you sure have gone to great lengths not to do so with the Bible.

H2026 harag hä·rag' slay, kill, kill..., murderer, destroyed, murder, out of hand, made, put, slain, slayer, surely
H2076 zabach zä·bakh' sacrifice, offer, kill, slay 
H2491 chalal khä·läl' slay, wounded, profane, kill, slain man
H2873 tabach tä·bakh' kill, slaughter, slay, slain
H4191 muwth müth die, dead, slay, death, surely, kill, dead man, dead body, in no wise, misc
H5221 nakah nä·kä' smite, slay, kill, beat, slaughter, stricken, given, wounded, strike, stripes, misc
H5362 naqaph nä·kaf' compass, go round about, go about, compass about, destroy, down, inclosed, kill, round
 H6991 qatal kä·tal' slay, kill
H7523 ratsach rä·tsakh' slayer, murderer, kill, murder, slain, manslayer, killing, slayer, slayeth, death
H7819 shachat shä·khat' kill, slay, offer, shot out, slaughter

These are all the various words used for the ending of a living things existence in the OT. The word used in the Ten Commandments is ratsach. It means specifically to murder. murder-Law. the killing of another human being under conditions specifically covered in law
You also seem to not understand the nature of the Bible. Surprise Surprise.  The book of Chronicles is a record of HISTORY. That means it was recorded faithfully wether or not the action with God's approval.

To the verses from Deuteronomy 28:53 concerning the consumption of flesh. God isn't commanding them to do that. He is telling them what will happen. He knew beforehand what was going to happen to them, from another nation, and told them as a warning.

And like I have told you before all of these actions were not left open ended. God never said continue to do this for all eternity. What do you not understand about that. These things that happened are meant to be kept within the context of history.

The verse from Proverbs doesn't even mention death. It says his lamp will be put out into obsure darkness. In other words he will be stupid, ignorant, unwise. The very people that flock to a religion that twists history to defend their nature.

The verses from Lev. are OT law. They were put in place to govern the children of Israel. Not the world. That is why they are a holy people. They were set apart by God and given these laws. What you don't seem to understand is that Jews don't kill their children for minor infractions. This law would be instituted in the most severe cases. Besides in case no one told you we reside under the New Covenant. Funny thing is the Orthodox Jew we have today still considers himself under the OT Law. Yet we hear no stories of Jews killing their children for a smart mouth. Wonder why?

For the Exodus verses same answer as above. Also I would like to add that the smiting that is used in the verse refering to "hitting" the father is nakah or KILL. You don't believe a person should be held responsible for killing his parents? What astounds me is you have a problem with the OT. These are the Laws that muslims so often level as indictments against Christians for not keeping. Odd. I also noticed you didn't quote from the NT. Have a hard time finding fodder there?

For your verse from Deut 17:12 again this is OT law. And maybe you didn't notice that part about evil in the verse. God made all these precautions to keep idolotry out of Israel. This was to keep the Israelites a holy people in order that the Messiah would come and save us all.

Now that all your erroneous claims have been refuted I would like to add something on a personal note.
Quote
Quote Qur'an (2:191-193) - "And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non-believers]... Look closer when they drove you out in verses .

bible is full of it too :
Only a child uses this logic. Only someone with an immature mind thinks he can expiate himself by pointing his finger at someone else and say "Well they did it too?"
« Last Edit: October 12, 2016, 06:34:58 AM by PeteWaldo »
Doth that man love his Lord who would be willing to see Jesus wearing a crown of thorns, while for himself he craves a chaplet of laurel? Shall Jesus ascend to his throne by the cross, and do we expect to be carried there on the shoulders of applauding crowds? Charles H. Spurgeon

resistingrexmundi

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2009, 10:18:23 AM »
I have already answered you in other posts about the nature of the OT law. You have a nack for ignoring facts and evidence but this does grow wearisome.

Quote
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." Matthew 10:34

IF you had read any more than this one verse, assuming you can read, you would have seen that Jesus was talking about the strife that would grow between family members as they acceted Jesus as their Messiah. And even today Jewish family members reject thier loved ones for accepting Jesus. Validation of the very verse you quote.

As for all of your claims regarding the OT verses I will say once again that they are laws for the JEWS ONLY. These laws are not meant to nor are they imposed on anyone else. The rest of the verses are historical events not necessarily the divine mandate of God. The ones that are were not open ended. They were a response to stimuli. Like Israeli counter attack to muslim terrorism.

Quote
What kind of God approves of murder, rape, and slavery?

Allah. Have you even read the koran?

Quote
Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst.  And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be removed from the city.   (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)

This is a verse referring to the last day. This shows all nations gathered against Jerusalem and God coming down to defend her. The rape and despoiling is being acted out by the aggressors. NOT the Jews.

Try as you might you have fallen short again.

Once again.
Quote
Only a child uses this logic. Only someone with an immature mind thinks he can expiate himself by pointing his finger at someone else and say "Well they did it too?"
Doth that man love his Lord who would be willing to see Jesus wearing a crown of thorns, while for himself he craves a chaplet of laurel? Shall Jesus ascend to his throne by the cross, and do we expect to be carried there on the shoulders of applauding crowds? Charles H. Spurgeon

SalahDinThe2nD

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2009, 09:56:17 AM »
Explained what ever you want but this verses is still givng freedom to kill

 
Quote
IF you had read any more than this one verse, assuming you can read, you would have seen that Jesus was talking about the strife that would grow between family members as they acceted Jesus as their Messiah. And even today Jewish family members reject thier loved ones for accepting Jesus. Validation of the very verse you quote.

Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." Matthew 10:34  you christ-pagans explained the verses of the quran as you want so in return we can read and explained as its .

It's speaking of someone who came form another place not earth  and he came to send sowrds .
Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;

Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;

He begetteth not, nor is He begotten

And there is none like unto Him

resistingrexmundi

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2009, 10:07:10 AM »
[disappeared then restored from database on 10-12-16]

Mat 10:35  For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

Mat 10:36  And a man's foes [shall be] they of his own household.

Mat 10:37  He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

Mat 10:38  And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

Mat 10:39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

Mat 10:40 He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.

Mat 10:41 He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet shall receive a prophet's reward; and he that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a righteous man shall receive a righteous man's reward.

Mat 10:42 And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold [water] only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.

Since you don't seem interested in looking at the rest of the chapter I will help you. These verses show things that were going to happen to those who accepted Christ. The moment that these Jews told their family that they had accepted Jesus their family turned against them. This is even the case in muslim countries. Notice that the followers of Jesus were not massacring anyone with swords in these verses. Jesus assures them though that their sacrafice will be rewarded.

You can believe what you wish but the proof is in the pudding. No other ideology inspires such hate and terror in the world than Islam.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2016, 06:33:11 AM by PeteWaldo »
Doth that man love his Lord who would be willing to see Jesus wearing a crown of thorns, while for himself he craves a chaplet of laurel? Shall Jesus ascend to his throne by the cross, and do we expect to be carried there on the shoulders of applauding crowds? Charles H. Spurgeon

Peter

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Re: The Violent Nature of the Quran & Fundamentalists that "Get" Islam
« Reply #9 on: December 01, 2009, 07:52:43 AM »
Explained what ever you want but this verses is still givng freedom to kill

Then it would be contrary to the whole message of the new covenant we are given through Jesus Christ.
You continue to spew lies. Where is the foundation for your claim? There is none. It comes from your pitiful broken mind as all Muslim minds have been broken for 1400 years, no differently than the followers of Jim Jones.

But your false accusation was perfectly prophesied:
2 Timothy 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2 For men shall be...boasters, proud, blasphemers...3 Without natural affection...false accusers...despisers of those that are good...8 ...so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith. 13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

Quote
IF you had read any more than this one verse, assuming you can read, you would have seen that Jesus was talking about the strife that would grow between family members as they acceted Jesus as their Messiah. And even today Jewish family members reject thier loved ones for accepting Jesus. Validation of the very verse you quote.

Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." Matthew 10:34  you christ-pagans explained the verses of the quran as you want so in return we can read and explained as its .

It's speaking of someone who came form another place not earth  and he came to send sowrds .

You see, you have no understanding of God or His Word. What is the "sword" Jesus references? It is the same sword that we have been slicing and dicing Mohammed and his phony book with in this forum:

Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places]. 13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. 14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; 15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace; 16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

Rev 2:16 Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth.

Hbr 4:12 For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

You can't expect to understand the things of the Spirit of God as long as you remain a natural man, SalahDinThe2nD. Actually you are in far worse shape than a natural man. Many of them are simply ignorant. You on the other hand worship the EXACT OPPOSITE of that revealed through God's Word and Jesus Christ. You worship Satan through the false prophet Mohammed.

1Cr 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.

A fuller explanation:
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=212.0