Chat with pah

[Peter]

brotherjw (3 days ago)
Pau: "So u were saying blood must be shed in order to get remission of sins? sounds like a devil teachings to me."

What was the purpose of the Temple of Solomon, built on the temple mount, for? The focus was the alter. That's where they sacrificed animals to God. Sometimes a little difficult for our 21st century minds to see, but this is how God revealed Himself.

It would sound of the devil to you, because your book was inspired by Satan.
The OPPOSITE of God's record.
watch?v=J9Rdej28pP4

Pah (3 days ago)
It sounds devil to me but i wasnt reading my book. i was reading yours :)

brotherjw (3 days ago)
At least you fully undertand that Mohammedanism is a STAND ALONE 6th century religion invented by A SINGLE illiterate.

Pah (2 days ago)
Mohammedanism?? i never heard such term. this is an example of how u christians simply put names and terms on things.u guys r famous for that. even the word 'christ' or 'bible' isnt in the original context of the TORAH :)

brotherjw (2 days ago)
Put Mohammedanism in a word document.
It will pass the spell check.
It is a traditional term for those that follow Mohammed, as opposed to the God of the Christians and Jews through His Word.

Pah (2 days ago)
Yeah words or terms given out by not even a muslim to muslims..and u expect us to accept
that? try harder dude. theres no such word or thing called 'Mohammedanism' in Islam. We dont
pray to Muhammad. We pray to the ONE AND ONLY GOD ALMIGHTY based on HIS teachings through one
of HIS messenger, Muhammad Salallahualaihiwasallam.

brotherjw (1 day ago)
Christians pray to the ONE and only God by the way that He chose to manifest Himself to us, Jesus Christ. THE WAY.

Jhn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
/user/Muslims4Jesus

Mohammed cannot be his messenger as his 23 year record is the DIRECT OPPOSITE of the 1600 year record of God through ALL the prophets and apostles.
That's what makes you a Mohammedan. You follow Mohammed.
beholdthebeast. com/islam_the_opposite. htm

Pah (1 day ago)
Beautiful chapter u gave me there ''THE ROAD''.

Jhn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Here's what i understand and correct me if i'm wrong..the word 'father' here refers to GOD and the only way to GOD,
is to follow HIS teachings, where the knowledge was given to Jesus for us to see. and NO MAN are on the RIGHT PATH
unless he follows what was thought by HIM through Jesus. (cont)

Pah (1 day ago)
So now tell me how did the idea of 'trinity' or 'cross'(y not triangle?) or whatever u call it comes out?.Are those teaching's
of Jesus? WHO was Jesus worshipping to? ofcourse GOD or 'THE FATHER' in your terms.Did Jesus worship himself? NO! and y are
u guys worshipping him as 'God'?

Jeremiah 1:16 I will pronounce my judgments on my people because of their wickedness in forsaking me,in burning incense
to other gods and in worshiping what their hands have made.
(cont)

brotherjw (1 day ago)
It was likely Constantine that coined the term "trinity", perhaps as a convenient way of describing the Godhead in one word. I already shared the Father, Word and Holy Spirit are ONE verse.
Here is also where it comes from, at the end of Jesus manifest to on earth:

Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Pah (15 hours ago)
U said ''It was likely Constantine that coined the term "trinity", perhaps as a convenient way of describing the Godhead in one word.''

Are we talking about Jesus teaching's or Constantine's here? and y r u even following him if u r not sure yourself that u said
''perhaps as a convinient way''. What if someone tells u that the most convinient way to GOD is directly to GOD HIMSELF, without any middle-man or any intermediary? (cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
and didnt u quote John 14:6 that says 'no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.'? and never did Jesus draw or create any tools or symbols like what u christians have today..the 'cross' or 'crucifix' or whatever u call it(cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

'baptize' means PERFORMING A CEREMONY to accept someone into the Christian faith. Does it say 'worship' or 'pray' or 'submit'? Does these words mean
the same as 'performing a ceremony'? i don't know, u tell me. English is my second language.

Pah (1 day ago)
Mohammedan? Like i said names or terms given by non-muslims to muslims. What if we call u guys 'comedian' or 'obamanism' ... u like it?
anymore terms or names?? LOL

brotherjw (1 day ago)
I am a Christian. I follow Jesus Christ.
You follow Mohammed, who was, and taught THE EXACT OPPOSITE.
Sorry, it's sad but true.
The most violent thing Jesus did was overturn the tables of the moneychangers.

Please watch this video:
watch?v=J9Rdej28pP4

Pah (2 days ago)
1)Ur 'God' has to die to save your sins. My GOD doesn't die. HE IS DIVINE. HE has no beginning nor ending.
2)Ur 'God' has 'parts'. My GOD doesnt have any parts. HE is THE ONE AND TRUE GOD.
3)Ur 'God' needs to be a father to create Jesus. My GOD create Jesus(Isa Alaihissalam) through Marry without having the need to be the father.
4)Ur 'God' breath,eat and drink. My GOD IS NOT HUMAN NOR HE IS ANYTHING THAT WE CAN IMAGINE.
So now isn't clear that my GOD is the ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD?

brotherjw (2 days ago)
God manifest Himself in Jesus Christ for a new covenant, through His shed blood. ONE sacrifice for all.

Mat 26:28 For this is MY BLOOD of the new testament, which is SHED FOR MANY for the remission of sins.

Prophesied in OT.

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah
33...I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.Judah:

Pah (2 days ago)
If u say Jesus(human)'s blood was shed for many for the remission of sins, that would've make some sense to me.But
if u say Jesus(part of GOD and also one with GOD)'s blood was shed,then it's entirely CRAP. because GOD IS DIVINE
and having blood is definitely NOT GOD.Therefore, I will only accept that Jesus(human) is a messenger of GOD and NOT
Jesus as 'God' or 'part of God' or 'one with God'.

brotherjw (1 day ago)
None of this is about what I SAY my friend:

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

islamandthetruth. com

Pah (1 day ago)
U said 'something OF HIS SPIRIT' taken by Surah As-Sajdah 32:9 whereas i checked it myself from the NOBLE QUR'AN, that it CLEARLY MENTIONED AS 'SOUL' in the Surrah. and now
u try to run away and twist things up by saying 'None of this is about what I SAY my friend'and giving me verses from John, WHICH YOU HAVE ALSO MADE YOUR OWN WORDS.
u said John 1:14 (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,).(cont)

brotherjw (1 day ago)
So Quran says God has a "soul".
In the Old Testament that "Spirit of God" is also understood in a Hebraism as "Breath of God".
Does Allah and His "soul" constitute 2 Gods, the way you measure Christians?

My quote of John 1:14 is copied directly from the KJV:
blueletterbible. org/Bible. cfm?b=Jhn&c=1&v=14&t=KJV#14

Another example:
1Jo 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

Pah (15 hours ago)
Didn't i quote clearly 1 day ago??.Here let me copy and paste it back...
I said "GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT!!.
Surah As-Sajdah 32:9 Then HE fashioned him in due proportion, and breathed into him
the soul(created by Allah for that person); and HE gave you hearing(ears), sight(eyes) and hearts. Little isthe thanks you give!.where did u get the words 'something OF HIS SPIRIT' from? or did u just made it up?(cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
didnt u see what was in the BRACKET? did it ever mentioned 'HIS soul'? im sorry i've to ask this..do you have a 'SHORT-TERM MEMORY LOSS'?

Pah (15 hours ago)
So tell me which word(s) is the exact interpretation and which versionssss are the true GOD'S words. keep in mind that if it is the same word(s) and the same interpretation,
it wouldn't have different VERSIONSSSS. and also keep this in mind ..to deny any words of GOD is to deny the ENTIRE BELIEF :)

Pah (1 day ago)
i checked myself that it was clearly written -
John 1;14 (We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only,who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.) 'CAME'FROM THE FATHER(GOD ALMIGHTY) NOT 'BEGOTTEN'.Are u even
a Christian? or r u trying to confuse people here? Am i talking to one of anti-christ activist himself here?

brotherjw (1 day ago)
You are quoting some New Age bible version. I quoted the KJV.
islamandthetruth. com

Indeed there are 10 verses that describe Jesus in relation to begotten or begat:
brotherpete. com/index. php?topic=215.0

Koine Greek word:
gennao
Translated as "begat" 49 times, "be born" 39 times in the KJV.
To suggest it doesn't belong, or is a mistranslation, would be to suggest that it's wrong 88 times.

Pah (15 hours ago)
King James version, New Age version,New International version, American Standard version, Amplified Bible version...and lots more and thats only in English.
Theres even different versions under different languages.and u cannot say its the same because some versions doesnt have the verses from the older versions
and some has added it back. 'begat' and 'be born'are not the same. 'begat' means to be the father of a child and 'be born' means to come out from a creatures womb. (cont)

brotherjw (1 day ago)
Pah, you folks are always saying that all God has to do is say "be" and something is.

Then you turn around and tell us about what God can and can't do, rather than taking His Word for it.

Stunningly, you instead, choose to follow the 23 year, heavily abrogated, record of recitations of A SINGLE, mentally underdeveloped, illiterate, 6th century desert dweller, who himself believed it was jinn who that he met in that cave.
brotherpete. com/index. php?topic=116.0

Pah (1 day ago)
True that GOD can create anything *bang* just like that. and the existence of every single cell,atom,nuclear in this entire galaxy that has formed in perfect way, is an example of what
THE ONE AND ONLY GOD CAN DO. What i'm trying to say is, how can Jesus bleed if he is 'God'(that u believe)? because bleeding reflects vulnerabilty and GOD IS INVULNERABLE. (cont)

Pah (1 day ago)
i'm not
telling you what GOD can and can't do. I'm telling u that it is IMPOSSIBLE that GOD bleeds,which is implying that GOD is vulnerable.that's plain simple english(which is not even my mother toungue)
and we're talking about your believe that Jesus is 'God' here. So now please tell me do u accept someone who bleeds as 'God'?

brotherjw (1 day ago)
"i'm nottelling you what GOD can and can't do. I'm telling u that it is IMPOSSIBLE that GOD bleeds,..."

Not only telling me what He can and can't do, but telling me what is IMPOSSIBLE for God to do. You just reinforced my point in spades.

Tell me, if God wanted to reveal Himself to us, as a man of flesh on earth, could he?

If God wanted to walk among us, could He make Himself into a man?

I don't doubt that's impossible for Allah, but nothing is impossible for my God.

Pah (15 hours ago)
Dind't the Biblesss mentioned what GOD can do?Isn't the very existence of the entire galaxy is what GOD can do? what?, r u denying the bibless now?and ofcourse there's nothing that GOD CAN'T DO. HIS powers are beyond our knowledge. but i was
talking about Jesus here.The Jesus that u(Mr.BrotherJesusWorshipper) believe to be 'God'.(cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
If u don't understand plain simple english, here let me ask again...Will you(brotherjw) accept and/or believe someone who bleeds, die and vulnerable as your GOD?.
Its your Jesus that you believe to be 'God' here, not mine and keep that in mind. I believe in Jesus(Isa Alaihissalam) but NOT AS GOD HIMSELF, but as mere messenger of GOD. that's what i believe...NOT U. See how u try to twist and turn things up and run like a coward little girl?(cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
About GOD revealing Himself to us :- If GOD wants to reveal HIMSELF for the convinience of HIS creation to see,HE doesn't have to become HIS own creation.Aren't the words of HIM is clear to our ears,eyes and hearts?Aren't the good deeds by HIS messengers are clear to us?
and IF GOD wanted to walk among us, HE DOESN'T HAVE TO become a man...because HE already was with us at the very beginning of our creation.The Soul(created by Allah S.W.T to that person) remember now? :)
(cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
U said ''I don't doubt that's impossible for Allah, but nothing is impossible for my God.'' It's your Jesus,whom u believe to be 'God' here that bleeds. NOT MINE :) and u are also agreeing that your 'God'(Jesus that u believe) can bleed. Pitty Pitty.(Islam 1 - Fake believers 0)
ALLAHUAKBAR!!!

brotherjw (1 day ago)
Pah, these are large subjects. We could have a much more fruitful and leisurely chat if we have it in the forum. It will be just you and I. Why not join me in there?
We can quote each other, post live links and such:
brotherpete. com/index. php

Again, please answer this simple question. If Allah wanted to form himself into a man on earth, and walk among us, could He?
Or would that be impossible for him?

Pah (15 hours ago)
Mr.Brotherjw, thank you for the offer but I don't have the LEISURELY TIME to chat.Still in my degree and besides here it starts where i find someone who says Islam was inspired by satan and who says Muhammad S.A.W is a coward for the first time, and here by GOD's permission it will end.
I was only looking for Mr.Deedats speech and i never thought it'll come this.(cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
For your information my neighbours and lots of my friends are Christians.But never i come across one who says such things. and i already answered your simple question. simple indeed.

[Peter]

brotherjw (3 days ago)
Pau: "So u were saying blood must be shed in order to get remission of sins? sounds like a devil teachings to me."

What was the purpose of the Temple of Solomon, built on the temple mount, for? The focus was the alter. That's where they sacrificed animals to God. Sometimes a little difficult for our 21st century minds to see, but this is how God revealed Himself.

It would sound of the devil to you, because your book was inspired by Satan.
The OPPOSITE of God's record.
watch?v=J9Rdej28pP4

Pah (3 days ago)
It sounds devil to me but i wasnt reading my book. i was reading yours :)

brotherjw (3 days ago)
At least you fully undertand that Mohammedanism is a STAND ALONE 6th century religion invented by A SINGLE illiterate.

Pah (2 days ago)
Mohammedanism?? i never heard such term. this is an example of how u christians simply put names and terms on things.u guys r famous for that. even the word 'christ' or 'bible' isnt in the original context of the TORAH :)

brotherjw (2 days ago)
Put Mohammedanism in a word document.
It will pass the spell check.
It is a traditional term for those that follow Mohammed, as opposed to the God of the Christians and Jews through His Word.

Pah (2 days ago)
Yeah words or terms given out by not even a muslim to muslims..and u expect us to accept
that? try harder dude. theres no such word or thing called 'Mohammedanism' in Islam. We dont
pray to Muhammad. We pray to the ONE AND ONLY GOD ALMIGHTY based on HIS teachings through one
of HIS messenger, Muhammad Salallahualaihiwasallam.

brotherjw (1 day ago)
Christians pray to the ONE and only God by the way that He chose to manifest Himself to us, Jesus Christ. THE WAY.

Jhn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
/user/Muslims4Jesus

Mohammed cannot be his messenger as his 23 year record is the DIRECT OPPOSITE of the 1600 year record of God through ALL the prophets and apostles.
That's what makes you a Mohammedan. You follow Mohammed.
beholdthebeast. com/islam_the_opposite. htm

Pah (1 day ago)
Beautiful chapter u gave me there ''THE ROAD''.

Jhn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Here's what i understand and correct me if i'm wrong..the word 'father' here refers to GOD and the only way to GOD,
is to follow HIS teachings, where the knowledge was given to Jesus for us to see. and NO MAN are on the RIGHT PATH
unless he follows what was thought by HIM through Jesus. (cont)

Pah (1 day ago)
So now tell me how did the idea of 'trinity' or 'cross'(y not triangle?) or whatever u call it comes out?.Are those teaching's
of Jesus? WHO was Jesus worshipping to? ofcourse GOD or 'THE FATHER' in your terms.Did Jesus worship himself? NO! and y are
u guys worshipping him as 'God'?

Jeremiah 1:16 I will pronounce my judgments on my people because of their wickedness in forsaking me,in burning incense
to other gods and in worshiping what their hands have made.
(cont)

brotherjw (1 day ago)
It was likely Constantine that coined the term "trinity", perhaps as a convenient way of describing the Godhead in one word. I already shared the Father, Word and Holy Spirit are ONE verse.
Here is also where it comes from, at the end of Jesus manifest to on earth:

Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Pah (15 hours ago)
U said ''It was likely Constantine that coined the term "trinity", perhaps as a convenient way of describing the Godhead in one word.''

Are we talking about Jesus teaching's or Constantine's here?

I explained that the doctrinal term trinity likely originated with Constantine.

Then I quoted you a verse from the bible to help you understand what it is about.
Here's another:

1Jo 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

and y r u even following him if u r not sure yourself that u said
''perhaps as a convinient way''. What if someone tells u that the most convinient way to GOD is directly to GOD HIMSELF, without any middle-man or any intermediary? (cont)

I would tell him simply that isn't the way God revealed Himself over a 1600 year record through ALL of the prophets and apostles.

1Ti 2:5 For [there is] one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Rom 3:25 Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation THROUGH FAITH IN HIS BLOOD, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Pah (15 hours ago)
and didnt u quote John 14:6 that says 'no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.'? and never did Jesus draw or create any tools or symbols like what u christians have today..the 'cross' or 'crucifix' or whatever u call it(cont)

Roman Catholics do. Orthodox in similar fashion have "icons". You also pointed out their error in wearing hats.

Exd 20:4 THOU SHALT NOT MAKE unto thee any graven image, or ANY LIKENESS [OF ANY THING] THAT [IS] IN HEAVEN above, or that [is] in the earth beneath, or that [is] in the water under the earth:

I don't believe it can be suggested that the above verse isn't valid under the old or new covenant.
Please don't use traditions of men, in an effort to to help you hide from the truth of the Word of God.

Pah (15 hours ago)
Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

'baptize' means PERFORMING A CEREMONY to accept someone into the Christian faith. Does it say 'worship' or 'pray' or 'submit'? Does these words mean
the same as 'performing a ceremony'? i don't know, u tell me. English is my second language.

It involves more than baptism. Baptism is for washing past sins. We become "born again".
But a relationship with God requires repentance:

Mar 2:17     When Jesus heard [it], he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Mar 1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

We leave this world and enter the kingdom of God. Our focus is on Him and away from the things of this world.

1Cr 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

[Peter]

Pah (1 day ago)
Mohammedan? Like i said names or terms given by non-muslims to muslims. What if we call u guys 'comedian' or 'obamanism' ... u like it?
anymore terms or names?? LOL

brotherjw (1 day ago)
I am a Christian. I follow Jesus Christ.
You follow Mohammed, who was, and taught THE EXACT OPPOSITE.
Sorry, it's sad but true.
The most violent thing Jesus did was overturn the tables of the moneychangers.

Please watch this video:
watch?v=J9Rdej28pP4

Pah (2 days ago)
1)Ur 'God' has to die to save your sins. My GOD doesn't die. HE IS DIVINE. HE has no beginning nor ending.
2)Ur 'God' has 'parts'. My GOD doesnt have any parts. HE is THE ONE AND TRUE GOD.
3)Ur 'God' needs to be a father to create Jesus. My GOD create Jesus(Isa Alaihissalam) through Marry without having the need to be the father.
4)Ur 'God' breath,eat and drink. My GOD IS NOT HUMAN NOR HE IS ANYTHING THAT WE CAN IMAGINE.
So now isn't clear that my GOD is the ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD?

brotherjw (2 days ago)
God manifest Himself in Jesus Christ for a new covenant, through His shed blood. ONE sacrifice for all.

Mat 26:28 For this is MY BLOOD of the new testament, which is SHED FOR MANY for the remission of sins.

Prophesied in OT.

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah
33...I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.Judah:

Pah (2 days ago)
If u say Jesus(human)'s blood was shed for many for the remission of sins, that would've make some sense to me.But
if u say Jesus(part of GOD and also one with GOD)'s blood was shed,then it's entirely CRAP. because GOD IS DIVINE
and having blood is definitely NOT GOD.Therefore, I will only accept that Jesus(human) is a messenger of GOD and NOT
Jesus as 'God' or 'part of God' or 'one with God'.

brotherjw (1 day ago)
None of this is about what I SAY my friend:

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

islamandthetruth. com

Pah (1 day ago)
U said 'something OF HIS SPIRIT' taken by Surah As-Sajdah 32:9 whereas i checked it myself from the NOBLE QUR'AN, that it CLEARLY MENTIONED AS 'SOUL' in the Surrah. and now
u try to run away and twist things up by saying 'None of this is about what I SAY my friend'and giving me verses from John, WHICH YOU HAVE ALSO MADE YOUR OWN WORDS.
u said John 1:14 (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,).(cont)

brotherjw (1 day ago)
So Quran says God has a "soul".
In the Old Testament that "Spirit of God" is also understood in a Hebraism as "Breath of God".
Does Allah and His "soul" constitute 2 Gods, the way you measure Christians?

My quote of John 1:14 is copied directly from the KJV:
blueletterbible. org/Bible. cfm?b=Jhn&c=1&v=14&t=KJV#14

Another example:
1Jo 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

Pah (15 hours ago)
Didn't i quote clearly 1 day ago??.Here let me copy and paste it back...
I said "GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT!!.
Surah As-Sajdah 32:9 Then HE fashioned him in due proportion, and breathed into him
the soul(created by Allah for that person); and HE gave you hearing(ears), sight(eyes) and hearts. Little isthe thanks you give!.where did u get the words 'something OF HIS SPIRIT' from? or did u just made it up?(cont)

032.009
YUSUFALI: But He fashioned him in due proportion, and breathed into him something OF HIS SPIRIT. And He gave you (the faculties of) hearing and sight and feeling (and understanding): little thanks do ye give!
PICKTHAL: Then He fashioned him and breathed into him OF HIS SPIRIT; and appointed for you hearing and sight and hearts. Small thanks give ye!
SHAKIR: Then He made him complete and breathed into him OF HIS SPIRIT, and made for you the ears and the eyes and the hearts; little is it that you give thanks.

I guess you can see how it might stretch the bounds of credulity, for you to suggest that somehow all 3 translators got it wrong, but you got it right.

Pah (15 hours ago)
didnt u see what was in the BRACKET? did it ever mentioned 'HIS soul'? im sorry i've to ask this..do you have a 'SHORT-TERM MEMORY LOSS'?

You are free to ask that, but why wouldn't you first suspect misunderstanding?
But then it seems I didn't misunderstand at all, but you did.

HIS SPIRIT. Allah's Spirit. Something of Allah's spirit.
Of course I recognize Mohammed's "Allah's" spirit to be that of the spirit of antichrist.

1 John 2:22  Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? HE IS ANTICHRIST, THAT DENIETH the Father and THE SON. 23 WHOSOEVER DENIETH THE SON, THE SAME HATH NOT THE FATHER:

Pah (15 hours ago)
So tell me which word(s) is the exact interpretation and which versionssss are the true GOD'S words. keep in mind that if it is the same word(s) and the same interpretation,
it wouldn't have different VERSIONSSSS. and also keep this in mind ..to deny any words of GOD is to deny the ENTIRE BELIEF :)

Over 5300 partial or complete manuscripts of God’s Word were penned prior to 300AD, in virtually every language that was known to man, that were read all over the known world.
To suggest it was tampered with would require that scribes from Syria, Babylonia, Galatia, Asia, India, Rome, Egypt, Greece, Carthage, Tarshish and Macedonia - to name a few - all made the same mistake, at the same time, for the same doctrinal purpose. Preposterous notion.
watch?v=6R2Zp7T5XlA

The Old Testament was written in Hebrew, with nearly half the book of Daniel written in Aramaic. The New Testament was written in Koine Greek. The Textus Receptus is the majority Greek text that is the basis of the KJV, which is the most widely used, and respected, ENGLISH version of God's Word. If a question arises in study it is good to consult a Textus Receptus Greek/English interlinear for help. Also Strong's definitions. A good online tool for these can be found here: http://www.olivetree.com/cgi-bin/EnglishBible.htm
Unfortunately the NewKJV is the default bible but you can see the verse in the KJV as well as Strong's and the interlinear with a click of the drop down menu on the left.

Most modern versions are based on a corrupt 19th century minority Greek text written by two individuals. Sad but true:
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=81.0

[Peter]

Pah (1 day ago)
i checked myself that it was clearly written -
John 1;14 (We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only,who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.) 'CAME'FROM THE FATHER(GOD ALMIGHTY) NOT 'BEGOTTEN'.Are u even
a Christian? or r u trying to confuse people here? Am i talking to one of anti-christ activist himself here?

brotherjw (1 day ago)
You are quoting some New Age bible version. I quoted the KJV.
islamandthetruth. com

Indeed there are 10 verses that describe Jesus in relation to begotten or begat:
brotherpete. com/index. php?topic=215.0

Koine Greek word:
gennao
Translated as "begat" 49 times, "be born" 39 times in the KJV.
To suggest it doesn't belong, or is a mistranslation, would be to suggest that it's wrong 88 times.

Pah (15 hours ago)
King James version, New Age version,New International version, American Standard version, Amplified Bible version...and lots more and thats only in English.

http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=81.0

Theres even different versions under different languages.and u cannot say its the same because some versions doesnt have the verses from the older versions

But we do. Discoveries of some of the original papyrii at Qumran in the late 1040s confirm that the Word of God has been handed down to us very much intact.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=97.0

The fact that we have over 5300 partial or complete manuscripts of God’s Word were penned prior to 300AD, in virtually every language that was known to man, that were read all over the known world, proves that it is unchanged.
As far as modern versions go, men will go to most any measure to embellish unsound doctrine and tradition.

and some has added it back. 'begat' and 'be born'are not the same. 'begat' means to be the father of a child and 'be born' means to come out from a creatures womb. (cont)

What are you arguing? That Jesus wasn't conceived in a virgin by the will of God? That Jesus didn't come out of Mary's womb?

[Peter]

brotherjw (1 day ago)
Pah, you folks are always saying that all God has to do is say "be" and something is.

Then you turn around and tell us about what God can and can't do, rather than taking His Word for it.

Stunningly, you instead, choose to follow the 23 year, heavily abrogated, record of recitations of A SINGLE, mentally underdeveloped, illiterate, 6th century desert dweller, who himself believed it was jinn who that he met in that cave.
brotherpete. com/index. php?topic=116.0

Pah (1 day ago)
True that GOD can create anything *bang* just like that. and the existence of every single cell,atom,nuclear in this entire galaxy that has formed in perfect way, is an example of what
THE ONE AND ONLY GOD CAN DO. What i'm trying to say is, how can Jesus bleed if he is 'God'(that u believe)? because bleeding reflects vulnerabilty and GOD IS INVULNERABLE. (cont)

Pah (1 day ago)
i'm not
telling you what GOD can and can't do. I'm telling u that it is IMPOSSIBLE that GOD bleeds,which is implying that GOD is vulnerable.that's plain simple english(which is not even my mother toungue)
and we're talking about your believe that Jesus is 'God' here. So now please tell me do u accept someone who bleeds as 'God'?

brotherjw (1 day ago)
"i'm nottelling you what GOD can and can't do. I'm telling u that it is IMPOSSIBLE that GOD bleeds,..."

Not only telling me what He can and can't do, but telling me what is IMPOSSIBLE for God to do. You just reinforced my point in spades.

Tell me, if God wanted to reveal Himself to us, as a man of flesh on earth, could he?

If God wanted to walk among us, could He make Himself into a man?

I don't doubt that's impossible for Allah, but nothing is impossible for my God.

Pah (15 hours ago)
Dind't the Biblesss mentioned what GOD can do?

The bible simply recorded what was, and is, and shall be, in regard to God as He revealed Himself to us.

Isn't the very existence of the entire galaxy is what GOD can do? what?, r u denying the bibless now?and ofcourse there's nothing that GOD CAN'T DO. HIS powers are beyond our knowledge.

Then we have a point of agreement. And the bible confirms it:

Rom 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable [are] his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

Yet you follow an illiterate, desert dwelling, 6th century prophet, that was and taught the opposite of Jesus, that put God in a box the size that his underdeveloped mind could conceive, rather than relying on the 1600 year record that God gave us.

But even your prophet said in the 6th century, long after the bible had been translated into virtually every language known to man:

Sura 4:136 O ye who believe! BELIEVE IN Allah and His Messenger, and the scripture which He hath sent to His Messenger and THE SCRIPTURE WHICH HE SENT TO THOSE BEFORE (HIM). ANY WHO DENIETH Allah, His angels, HIS BOOKS, HIS MESSENGERS, and the Day of Judgment, HATH GONE FAR, FAR ASTRAY.

Yet, directly against Mohammed's words, you call the bible corrupt, rather that believing it.

but i was
talking about Jesus here.The Jesus that u(Mr.BrotherJesusWorshipper) believe to be 'God'.(cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
If u don't understand plain simple english, here let me ask again...Will you(brotherjw) accept and/or believe someone who bleeds, die and vulnerable as your GOD?.

I believe that if God chose to reveal Himself in the flesh of a man, and walk among us on earth, He could. If he chose for this manifestation to bleed, as any other man He could. I know this because He did. This is the WHOLE SUBJECT of the new covenant, as revealed in the New Testament.

It is also the fulfillment of that new covenant that was prophesied in the Old Testament hundreds of years before God made Himself manifest in the flesh of Jesus Christ. Here is some prophecy:

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah
33...I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Jesus filfilled that prophecy through His shed blood which was also prophesied:

Psa 22:16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.

Zec 12:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, [that] I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem. 10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for [his] only [son], and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for [his] firstborn.

[Peter]

Its your Jesus that you believe to be 'God' here, not mine and keep that in mind.

Because Jesus declared it Himself:

John 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS, I AM. 59 Then took they up stones to cast at him:

Now if Jesus isn't God, how do you explain this declaration after He was resurrected?

Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, ALL POWER IS GIVEN UNTO ME IN HEAVEN AND IN EARTH. 19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Just another son of God? He will be our judge, my friend, of those that declare Him and those that deny His shed blood:

Jhn 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:

I believe in Jesus(Isa Alaihissalam)

Satan believes in Jesus too.

2Jo 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

but NOT AS GOD HIMSELF, but as mere messenger of GOD. that's what i believe...NOT U.

Doesn't it ever strike you as odd that you refer to the only person you believe was ever born of a virgin by the will of God, as "a mere messenger"?

See how u try to twist and turn things up and run like a coward little girl?(cont)

What's twisted? You put Jesus, the only person ever born of a virgin by the will of God, on the same level as a 6th century, illiterate, pillaging, plundering, murdering, child doing, stepson's wife taking, sex slave capturing, slave pimping, concubine fornicating, bloody imperialistic coward and thief. A man, and book that are THE EXACT OPPOSITE of Jesus and the New Testament.

If a single of these characterizations (I left lots out) is incorrect please tell me which.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=336.0

Pah (15 hours ago)
About GOD revealing Himself to us :- If GOD wants to reveal HIMSELF for the convinience of HIS creation to see,HE doesn't have to become HIS own creation.

See how foolish your statement? God doesn't HAVE TO do anything. You are assigning to Him nothing more than foolish presumption. We can only know how He revealed Himself by His Word.

Aren't the words of HIM is clear to our ears,eyes and hearts?Aren't the good deeds by HIS messengers are clear to us?

Through His true messengers yes. NOT through false prophets. And certainly not through THE false prophet that was, and taught, the EXACT OPPOSITE, of the 1600 year record of God's Word.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=148.0

and IF GOD wanted to walk among us, HE DOESN'T HAVE TO become a man...

He doesn't HAVE TO do anything. That is simply WHAT HE DID:

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

because HE already was with us at the very beginning of our creation.The Soul(created by Allah S.W.T to that person) remember now?
(cont)

Pah (15 hours ago)
U said ''I don't doubt that's impossible for Allah, but nothing is impossible for my God.'' It's your Jesus,whom u believe to be 'God' here that bleeds. NOT MINE

Indeed. And He bled for Gentiles like you and I.

Rom 3:25 Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation THROUGH FAITH IN HIS BLOOD, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Mat 26:28 For this is MY BLOOD of the new testament, which is SHED FOR MANY for the remission of sins.

Here's why:

Hbr 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and WITHOUT SHEDDING OF BLOOD IS NO REMISSION.

and u are also agreeing that your 'God'(Jesus that u believe) can bleed. Pitty Pitty.(Islam 1 - Fake believers 0)
ALLAHUAKBAR!!!

Not only can, but did.

[Peter]

brotherjw (1 day ago)
Pah, these are large subjects. We could have a much more fruitful and leisurely chat if we have it in the forum. It will be just you and I. Why not join me in there?
We can quote each other, post live links and such:
brotherpete. com/index. php

Again, please answer this simple question. If Allah wanted to form himself into a man on earth, and walk among us, could He?
Or would that be impossible for him?

Pah (15 hours ago)
Mr.Brotherjw, thank you for the offer but I don't have the LEISURELY TIME to chat.

By leisurely I meant a conversation that could take place sporadically, but still remain organized over a day, week, month or year.

Still in my degree and besides here it starts where i find someone who says Islam was inspired by satan

Mohammed was, and taught, the exact opposite of Jesus Christ. That's a fact. So one MUST CHOOSE. The God of the Christians and Jews, or the one of Mohammed, that curses the Christians and Jews:

Surah 9.30 The Jews call 'Uzair a son of God, and the Christians call Christ the Son of God. That is a saying from their mouth; (In this) they but imitate what the Unbelievers of old used to say. God's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!

and who says Muhammad S.A.W is a coward for the first time,

Mohammed was a coward as bequeathed through your own books. Whether suggesting the murder of poets in their sleep, on with a child at her breast.
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=127.0

Or his saying, "who will carry my sword into battle", as he retired to a distant hill surrounded by 12 body guards, wearing 2 suits of chainmail. And when the hill did eventually get overrun he played possum, pretending to be dead. What do you call that? Bravery?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MG1MiLqH0jc

and here by GOD's permission it will end.
I was only looking for Mr.Deedats speech and i never thought it'll come this.(cont)

As I have demonstrated, Deedat deceived you poor bible-ignorant folks with a phony bible verse of his own creation.
Even making the preposterous claim that the First Epistle of John confirms Mohammed was not antichrist, and was a true prophet. Did you ever read it, or just take a liar's word for it? Why not read a little and see if you agree with Deedat?
http://islamchristianforum.com/index.php?topic=268.0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_4_tbN-b_A

Pah (15 hours ago)
For your information my neighbours and lots of my friends are Christians.But never i come across one who says such things.

It could be that your Christian friends are almost as ignorant to the bible as they are the Quran.
It could be that they don't love you enough to present the truth of God's Word to them.

Try this. Why don't you present to them just a few verses from the Quran, and ask them if they believe that Mohammed's religion is a way to God according to their bible? Try showing them thise:

Surah 4.157 That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-

Sura 19:88 They say: "(Allah) Most Gracious has begotten a son!" 89 Indeed ye have put forth a thing most monstrous!

Surah 9.30 The Jews call 'Uzair a son of God, and the Christians call Christ the Son of God. That is a saying from their mouth; (In this) they but imitate what the Unbelievers of old used to say. God's curse be on them: how they are deluded away from the Truth!

and i already answered your simple question. simple indeed.

I must have missed it. So you agree that if God chose to manifest Himself in a man, and walk among us, He could?
You see the Jews missed Him too.
They expected a powerful king. Jesus wasn't what they expected.
You say that God couldn't walk among us in the flesh of a man, or at least that if He did, He couldn't bleed.
You assigned what God can and can't do rather than trusting in His Word.